Update on the SD 15 Busing Controversy
From Superintendent John Fitzsimons
With the opening of school each year we invariably experience some glitches in transporting 5,800 district children to and from over 95 public and private schools. I can assure you that our Transportation Department is working hard to address these problems. One such problem is the length of time children are on the bus.Good to hear. We all hope that they are acting in good faith and that the problems we have been experiencing will be cleared up.
We are gathering information on the length of each bus route from our bus contractor. By September 15th, we will have in place a corrective action plan that will ensure that no child who attends public or private schools within the district boundaries will spend more than one hour on a bus. Ideally, we will try to reduce the time to forty-five minutes or less wherever possible. We may, if adequate funds are available, and with Board of Education approval, add additional buses and vans to shorten the length of bus routes.
Our mission is to provide safe and efficient transportation to all our school age children in the district. We appreciate the support received from public and private school parents during these first two weeks of school.
posted by orthomom at 3:45 PM
57 Comments:
The earlier posting seemed to suggest that this is a problem stemmed at "punishing" a select portion of our community. I honestly don't think that's the case.
Did anyone just attribute these horrific delays to simple incompetance?
Since Mr. Pape retired, there's a new director in busing. Isn't this her first summer in the job? If so, isn't the summer when the bus routes are made?
Fitzsimons's suggestion about needing funds is pure garbage. The transportation budget was not cut since the budget was developed by the Board last spring. They knew the number of students and alloted the money to transport them. So if it wasn't incompetance, then it was an attempt to cheat the community out of decent bus service to save a nickel.
Either way, shame on them.
What ever happened to peace love and understanding? All I see is news on .
It's great that Dr. Fitzsimons has a plan to fix the problems by the 15th. He should spend ALL his time IN the transportaton office helping to solve the issues and answering phones. Talk is cheap-actions speak louder than words. If he can't fix the problems he should get Mr. Pape out of retirement.
No way Fiztsimons would go for that idea and come into the office by 7am to handle bus problems. He is used to strolling into the office closer to 9
who are you to say what Fitzsimons would or would not do...
who are you to say what Fitzsimons would or would not do...
Mrs. Fitzsimons. That's who! And by the way, that's MISTER FITZSIMONS to you.
Fitzsimons is the one who created this mess - so it would be hard to believe that he's proactively resolving this mess
My husband works very hard for the public school students. You have no right accusing him of creating a mess. You people are a mess. If you don't like your busses then take public transportation. But stop saying all these bad things about my husband. He doesn't deserve this criticism.
Whether or not he's your husband, and whether or not you would like to consider this a mess, Dr. Fitzsimons is solely responsible for deciding that buses should be consolidated and that children should walk further for bus pickup and spend up to 2 hours on the bus each way.
to anon 11:31 AM
if he's used to strolling to the office...that doesn't indicate hard work. Especially strolling to the office at 9 AM at the begining of the school year.
Oh, and a crash course on blogging, before submitting your comment just select "other", pick a name and stick to it, so we don't speak with 100 of anonymous individuals.
Why should the community accept sub-standard transportation at the expense of our kids?
A budget was created last winter. This summer, the contingency budget showed $0 cuts in transportation.
So why is Fitzsimons trying to cheapen transportation this way? In past years, the most my children sat on a bus was 35 minutes --- even during the first week of school. This year, it's a record 1 hour, 20 minutes.
Time our new board of education show its authority and required the superintendent to sit in transportation office until he fixes this mess. And if he won't do it, let's get another superintendent who can.
Is that OK with you, Mrs. Fitz? Hehe
2 1/2 days of school does not a budget/political crisis beget.
In this era of zero tolerence, please try to show koved habriot and act like menchen (Even if it were not chodesh elul, 1 week before slichot). When Pape was here everyone wanted to lynch him, now that he is gone we long for his return, how ironic.
Dr. F is trying to balance on a very thin rope. Give hime time, that s the only commidity that we can't pay for thankfully).
by the way my child in Public School travels for over 45 min, My kids in yeshiva 15. Who would have thought.
DR F is proposing a soultioon and a deadline. Thats pretty fair.
Is that OK with you, Mrs. Fitz? Hehe
You people are a disgrace. You should appreciate that you even get busses. This website does nothing but foment hatred. What did the public schools ever do to you anyway? If I were my husband, I wouldn't even let you people have bussing. I'd make everyone walk to school or drive in your fancy cars. Or have your maids carry the children to school.
"You people are a disgrace. You should appreciate that you even get busses."
With sentiments like that going around, the new board should have no qualms about kicking off a pay-as-you-go extracurricular program
DR F is proposing a soultioon and a deadline. Thats pretty fair.
Dr. F. deliberately shafted the private school children by unilaterally cutting back on the only service they receive with little or no justification. Now, he acts like he's the good guy by pledging to reinstate some of it.
He should be shown the door, so he can play his games on someone else's dollar
Show Dr Fitzsimons the door to the transportation office. Let him answer phones at 7:00am. That way he'll get first hand knwledge as to what the problems are for both the public and private schools. I don't want to be waiting on a corner and no bus shows again.
"DR F is proposing a soultioon and a deadline. Thats pretty fair.
Dr. F. deliberately shafted the private school children by unilaterally cutting back on the only service they receive with little or no justification. Now, he acts like he's the good guy by pledging to reinstate some of it.
He should be shown the door, so he can play his games on someone else's dollar"
SO NOW IS THE ACID TEST. HE HAS GIVEN HIMSELF UNTIL FRIDAY. HE SCREWS UP AND THERE IS THE JUSTIFICATION (THERE WILL NEVER BE 100% SATISFACTION ONLY 100% COMPLIANING). HE PRODUCES AND HE IS ENTITLED TO AN APOLOGY (WHICH I AM SURE HE WILL NOT GET).
I WENT TO SOUTH SHORE OVER 30 YEARS AGO AND LIVED IN FAR ROCKAWAY. WE WALKED 6 BLOCKS TO THE "CENTRAL COMMUNAL BUS STOP". THE BUS DID NOT WAIT 1 SECOND. IF YOU WERE NOT AT THE STOP HE LEFT WITHOUT U, EVEN IF ANOTHER MOTHER SAID WAIT I SEE HIM.
Anonymous said...
I WENT TO SOUTH SHORE OVER 30 YEARS AGO AND LIVED IN FAR ROCKAWAY. WE WALKED 6 BLOCKS TO THE "CENTRAL COMMUNAL BUS STOP". THE BUS DID NOT WAIT 1 SECOND. IF YOU WERE NOT AT THE STOP HE LEFT WITHOUT U, EVEN IF ANOTHER MOTHER SAID WAIT I SEE HIM.
1. Your caps lock key must be stuck. Or stop shouting.
2. It really doesn't matter what went on 30 years ago. The question is whether with the obscenely high per-student spending in this district in 2006, it should be acceptable to hve 5 year olds waiting on busy corners 4 blocks from their homes at 7 am. And I think teh answer is no. If we can find the money for all sorts of nonessential clubs and extracuricullars in the public schools, we can find the cash to make our kids transportation safe.
Sorry for the caps lock.
I know it sounds like the parent who says you think you have it bad i had to walk to school in the snow, up hill both ways, but
The fact of the matter is that everyone seems to have this entitlement theory about bussing. I do to. But I also subscribe to the theory that when it comes to cerain things in life, you get what you get and you don't get upset. But yiou alos catch more flies with honey then you do with s**t. Why antogonize on opening day. Bussing seems to be one of the areas where we can never seem to please. If we give to much them next year we seem like vilins. If qwe give to little then we long for the previous vilian that we used to complain about and pray for his quick return. Take Dr F at his word and if he doesent produce then lynch him.
Why antogonize on opening day. Bussing seems to be one of the areas where we can never seem to please.
That's a very strange attitude to take when there has been an unprecedented substantial reduction of service (which now appears to have been a premeditated effort by the superintendent).
"premeditated"
This would in my mind propose some maliciuos intent. Is that in fact what you are saying?? Can you provide some proof for this very serious accusation?? Does Dr F, as an employee of the BOE have the power to that premeditated action and reduce funding in a budgted lineitem withjout the BOE approval? Are you proposing that Dr F undertook on his own to cut transportation funding and sneak this through under the watchful eyes of the newly constituted and vigirously aggressive (their aggressiveness being a positive developement) new board. If you have soem inside information that has not been publicized then please share it. Orthomon who usuaylly seems to provide intimate details about controversial topics has not provided any factual accounts that support your accusuation of malicious intent. As I said before and will say again. If he is wrong then lynch him.
Does Dr F, as an employee of the BOE have the power to that premeditated action and reduce funding in a budgted lineitem withjout the BOE approval?
YES
Are you proposing that Dr F undertook on his own to cut transportation funding and sneak this through under the watchful eyes of the newly constituted and vigirously aggressive (their aggressiveness being a positive developement) new board.
YES, though he actually did not even cut the funding - just the level of services with the "justification" that funding would have had to be increased to cover the rising cost of gas, if the level of service were not cut.
"YES, though he actually did not even cut the funding - just the level of services with the "justification" that funding would have had to be increased to cover the rising cost of gas, if the level of service were not cut."
What is the proof of this??
"YES, though he actually did not even cut the funding - just the level of services with the "justification" that funding would have had to be increased to cover the rising cost of gas, if the level of service were not cut."
This makes no sense given that gas prices are at a 6 month low.
The real question is who did the routing, who approved the changes and what if any are the savings? Answer these questions to find who's responsible for the current problems. Our children need reasonable and safe transportation services. The gas rationale is an excuse, not an answer.
What is the proof of this??
This has been the Superintendent's explanation since the changes were made. (If this is Fitzsimons explanation, what exactly are you looking for proof of?)
This makes no sense given that gas prices are at a 6 month low.
Actually, this makes no sense anyway you look at it. But the decision was apparently made by Fitzsimons before the summer, or at least a couple of months ago.
The real question is who did the routing, who approved the changes and what if any are the savings?
That new bumbling incompetent in the transportation office did the routing, at the intruction of Fitzsimons, and the changes to routing (i.e., consolidation of buses, moving pickup locations farther from children's houses) were directed (and obviously approved) by Fitzsimons.
"If this is Fitzsimons explanation, what exactly are you looking for proof of?)"
He said in writing there are glitches. He never said he cut funding. I believe that to the contrary his written explaination is that he was going to seek additional funding from the BOE (if necessary)to "add additional buses and vans to shorten the length of bus routes"
This is not a written admission of premeidtated actionj. Once again wher is your proof. Please point me in th direction of some statement that DR F that admits that he cut the budget.
If you find this so hard to believe, you should probably call him so you can hear it straight from the horse's mouth.
This is the explanation that he has given, and he hasn't even backed off it. If it would be more meaningful to you in writing, then you can try to have him deposed with wintnesses.
So you finally said it out loud. He is saying this verbally. Hearsay, so he'll probably deny it if deposed, but, Thank you for finally citeing your source however weak it is. So I ask again, is he allowed to do this on his own?? How can an employee on his own change a budget allocation?? Isn't the BOE angry that he did something so drastic without their approval?? Did't we elect them to be our wacth dog over our small but important services.
I have found with this school district in particuliar you can get a lot more traction with them with honey then with S**t. The more aggressive you get with them the less responsive they become (human nature). If you speak nicley and act like a mench, even if you stnd your ground you will usually get the proper attentuion to your problem. Trying to throw weight around, threatning, name calling and intemidation is not the route to positive results.
ORTHOMOM
you usually have good information, what is your take on the the reasons for the transportation problems.
If you speak nicley and act like a mench, even if you stnd your ground you will usually get the proper attentuion to your problem.
Fitzsimons is a snake - with a smile. As the chief executive office of the district, there is nothing stopping him from making "executive" decisions such as whether to "tighten" or change transportation standards within the existing legal parameters. In all likelihood, this decision was made when the previous board was around, but who knows if they were even made aware of it.
That being said, it's no secret how much busing is coveted by private school parents, given the fact that it's the only significant benefit received by most of them. So, it's difficult to imagine anyone in the administration would not realize the impact of any cuts in the level of service on private school parents in particular.
Yes, but they also know that to stop all bussing requires a referendum and it will fail, so being on you best behavior, while still advocating and not hitting below the belt is the beats way to deal with this problem. Name calling accomplishes nothing.
How many discruntled parents will show up at the next BOE meeting? Do they even know when it is? (9/19 by the way) Do they know that they can call the BOE directly and complain, like menchen?? Or would they rather take the approach of the teachers and scream and yell and name call, and harass and hope for the best? Take the high road.
"by the way my child in Public School travels for over 45 min, My kids in yeshiva 15. Who would have thought."
Public School bus is now running at 30 min after 1 week of school. They have improved.
Do they know that they can call the BOE directly and complain, like menchen??
YOU'VE GOTTA BE KIDDING - COMPLAIN LIKE MENCHEN? HERE'S WHAT PARENTS GET FOR COMPLAINING LIKE MENCHEN:
Then, we're forced to wait on line at the office for as much as an hour, only to be told either "put it in writing" or "wait a month and see if it works out" or "there's a 2-3 week wait for any changes"
You gotta stop the caps. No yelling please.
I am sure that those who called the Transportation office were very hostile, (as your caps laden message is).
Show up at the 9/19 meeting and publically complain.
While the transportation office keeps insisting that ALL [pardon the caps] stops are now corner stops, which is why my 5 year old cannot be picked up or dropped off in front of the house -- though she is the only one on the stop and the bus passes this way when it drops her off -- my neighbors, who are considerably older, still enjoy pick up in front of their house. Their children go to HALB, which has the pull of Paper (formerly of that office) working for them. So some yeshivas are more equal then others. Also the transportation office admitted that public school preschoolers in the number 4 and Hewlett schools are getting door-to-door transportation.
Show up at the 9/19 meeting and publically complain.
Sure, I'd love to show up at a board meeting where they start late and complain until 11pm or later. But I have to get my kid up at 5:30am to be picked up by a schoolbus by 6:30am so she can get to school in the 5 Towns by 8am.
Something is seriously wrong with that....no one I've spoken with has said it was EVER this bad.
ORTHOMOM, you seem overly quiet on this topic.
"no one I've spoken with has said it was EVER this bad."
Without discounting the heresay cliam that Dr F admits he cut the routes, this is the 1st year without Mr. Pape (the now most beloved former LPS employee), who ran transportation forever. That can add to the some of the EVER, as you probably don't remember the old days as those of us who are here close to 30 years do (even us orthos). Communal stops etc.
Dr F has 2 more days. If you are not satisfied, sleep in on Shabbat 9/16 and come rested to the meeting on 9/19
"sleep in on Shabbat 9/16"
Sorry and go to early slichot on 9/17...
I find all these complaints comical. Bottom line I think everyone should just say it as it is. The ortho community doesnt give 2 shits about the public school system, nor should we. The public school community has every right to fight back just as much as we do. Instead of bitching and moaning we should channel our energy to figuring out a solution that avoids the problem. Tie up loose ends - do not give your opponent opportunity. Shoot to kill, not wound!!!
I have been dealing with LPS on matters of greater concern then bussing. I have found that most employees (espically the new regieme in Pupil Personel) to be pleasent and helpful, without regard for my religious persuasion. I have found that even when I do not agree with a decisionmakers decision, as long as I am firm, but menchlech, I will be able to presuade the decision maker to at least revisit the topic, and usually to my success.
Fighting will accomplish nothing, except raise blood pressure. I agree with anno 4:52, we should stop bitching and moaning and we should channel our energy to figuring out a solution that avoids the problem. If all we do is yell how much we hate the problem and how bad THEY are, we are not part of the solution.
Parents boycott buses
In Roslyn, kids will no longer get door-to-door service, must now wait for pickups at corner
BY JENNIFER SINCO KELLEHER
Newsday Staff Writer
September 14, 2006
For years, the unofficial bus stops for hundreds of elementary school students in Roslyn were right in front of their homes.
But starting this school year, those children are being picked up and dropped off at street corners near their homes because of a policy the district's Board of Education approved in the spring as a way to save money, school officials said yesterday.
A letter dated Aug. 7 from interim Superintendent Gerard Dempsey explaining the new stops set off complaints from parents who said they weren't given any prior notice of the decision and that the street corners aren't safe. This week, some parents staged an impromptu boycott, keeping their children off the buses.
Robby Weinbaum, 7, now has to cross the street to get to the bus, when in the past all he had to do was walk to the end of his family's driveway. His mother, Rikki Weinbaum, said she's not asking for door-to-door service, but would like the stop to at least be on her side of the street.
"They really didn't do the proper research," she said of school officials' decisions on where to put new stops. "It was done a little covertly."
Dempsey, in an interview yesterday, responded that communication about the change could have been better. Parents who believe their bus stops are unsafe should contact the district, he said, and officials will re-evaluate those stops.
There are about 1,500 elementary students in the district and about half were dropped off at individual stops in the past, Dempsey said. With the buses now making less stops, the district is projecting an annual savings of $120,000.
Dempsey said four of about 30 buses have been taken off the public school routes and are being used for private school transportation, which state law requires the district to provide. In the past, the district paid a contractor for private school buses.
But fewer buses means overcrowding on-board, parent Lori Black said. Now students are having to sit three to a seat, and Black pointed out that some seats have had four kids because the younger children are too intimidated to ask the older ones to scoot over.
Black said when she first moved to the area in 2004, her stop was across the street, but officials then deemed the stop unsafe and moved it in front of her house. Now the stop is back to where it originally was.
It's common for Long Island students to have to walk to their corner to wait for the bus, but Roslyn parents said their community lacks sidewalks, and has more hills and curves and distance separating properties.
"My son has to walk 110 feet before he even gets to the street," said Harold Morgenstern. "I had trained my son, who just turned 7, 'Don't walk in the street, it's not safe.'"
Two school board members reached yesterday declined to comment.
In nearby Port Washington, where some houses also are a distance apart, bus stops are at corners. "If we tried to stop door-to-door, it would take a lot of time," Superintendent Geoffrey Gordon said.
Peter Mannella, executive director of the New York Association for Pupil Transportation in Albany, said state laws don't govern where districts must place bus stops. He said some districts consider fuel costs and traffic in deciding to put stops at corners.
Copyright 2006 Newsday Inc.
"Instead of bitching and moaning we should channel our energy to figuring out a solution that avoids the problem. Tie up loose ends - do not give your opponent opportunity. Shoot to kill, not wound!!!"
Lovely statement. Just where do you come from????
lol...That is hilarious! thanks for the laugh!
lol...That is hilarious! thanks for the laugh!h!
Well, Fitz asked us to give him until 9.15 to make things better. And to go from 1:30 travel time to 1:10 travel time (instead of 30-35 minutes the past 6 years) is unacceptable.
The Transportation Committee of the Lawrence Union Free Schools Board of Education will convene a public meeting regarding transportation on Monday, September 18, 2006 at 8:30 p.m. in cafeteria A of the Lawrence Middle School, 195 Broadway, Lawrence. The public is welcome. The Committee will present an opportunity for community remarks.
We need to have a MAJOR ATTENDANCE among all parents to complain about the superintendent's attepts to cheapen service for all of the kids. This isn't a public vs. private issue. This is a community vs. superintendent issue.
Does anyone really think he's done a good job? Since they brought that theif from CT in 7 years ago, it went into the toilet.
What else changed between then and now for your children: are they still being picked up at the same corner, are they in the same school, are they on the same type of bus. Not to be rude, but you need to look at the matter from all angles.
OK psmom. My younger one is at the same school my older one was 4 years ago, same size bus.
But my little one takes twice as long to get to school (1:10 instead of 25 minutes).
There used to be 40 or so children on a bus. The district is cramming 50 to 60 kids on the buses.
So not to be rude either, but you need to keep your condecension to yourself. Most parents see the problem. The district apoligized for the problem and promised to fix it right away, and little has been fixed. You're still asking "is there a problem?"
Oy vey....
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/16/nyregion/nyregionspecial2/17Rlawrence.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1
oy va voy...
the route might have changed, which could be why it takes longer. But 60 kids on the bus isn't it over the limit, how many seats are on the bus, I believe it should be clearly stated on the side of the bus, and if it's within the limit, I guess you nor anyone else can do anything about it. Hey then you should be just greatful that your older children only had it so good. Good luck one way or the other.
large busses, only 50 allowed
If you cram 3 kids in each seat, maybe you can fit 60 or even 66. But kids are fat these days and you can't fit 3 in a row.
Also, I've seen 4 small kids crammed in a seat because the little ones are scared to sit next to a big kid. And the drivers aren't doing anything to help.
Lord help you if you want your child in a seat belt.
Still, there's no reason for bus service to a school 1.3 miles away to take over an hour....that's just bad planning. She could walk there faster.
Hey Fitz....why don't you take that fancy car and start giving kids a lift!
Fat kids: I don't believe you are blaming the district for that. Seatbelts: I believe that the rule is that they must be able to buckle and unbuclke it by themselves. When you think about it, it's a smart idea and if my 4 year old did it over the summer (all by himself) so can any other child, remember it's not 5-point harness belt, but only the lap belt. And I do believe that the driver should concentrate on driving and keeping the bus safe, if there are unbehaved children on the bus driver should pull over, write down the incident and ban the kid from the bus for a day or two. But then watch out for those parents.
and if 1.3 mile route has 50 kids (assuming that's the max) to pick up it will easily take close to 1 hour, remember that the bus does not drive straight to school.
As a side not: I don't know what Dr. F is driving, but many complaining residents are driving top line cars, so leave sarcasm out and maybe we'll all get somewhere.
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