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Tuesday, December 11, 2007

NYT on Lakewood, NJ

This article in yesterday's NYT raises some interesting issues regarding the changing demographics of Lakewood, NJ. The township has witnessed exponential growth in its Orthodox population, and with that growth, an increase in tensions between town residents. In some ways, the tensions described are similar to the resentment that seems to occur whenever a locale goes through a significant demographic change, in other ways the situation is unique to those areas that have seen themselves being increasingly populated by Orthodox Jews. Few other demographic groups move into communities en masse with the intent to create and patronize their own schools, places of worship, eateries and stores. Even if such de facto self-segregation is not the intention, but just the byproduct of practices that are intended to preserve traditional and religious standards, articles such as this one, that highlight the negative sentiment that can arise in such situations (much like the situation here in the Five Towns), should serve as a reminder that the Orthodox populations in such areas should make every attempt to assuage the negative sentiment that seems to arise wherever they create communities that give the impression of isolationism. Making inroads and exploring ways to get along with those who are different can certainly only help cool simmering tensions - whether here in the Five Towns, in Lakewood, or in any other community staring down the barrel of a sudden demographic shift.

One paragraph from the NYT article that particularly piqued my interest with it's relevance to the battles over the school board here in District 15:
There have been fights about the administration of the school system. Orthodox Jewish students attend private schools, but are eligible for millions of dollars of public money for busing, according to the town’s current mayor, Ray Coles. Black residents have complained that decisions about public schools attended largely by black and Hispanic students are made by a school board where 5 of the 9 members are Orthodox Jews.

Warren A. Sherard, the head of the local N.A.A.C.P. branch, said he had tried to get black residents more invested in the politics of the town.

“I went to churches and told people, ‘We need to vote in school board elections,’ ” he said. “I know people want to throw stones, but everyone’s got to vote.”
One point I feel I must make is that there is absolutely nothing wrong, or sinister, or untoward about the fact that, as the Times puts it, "Orthodox Jewish students attend private schools, but are eligible for millions of dollars of public money for busing". Busing is absolutely the right of every district resident, no matter where that child attend school. The implication on the part of the NYT that this complaint against the private school residents somehow actually holds water is irresponsible.

Another interesting point that is directly relevant to tensions in my district is the issue of the local school board holding a majority of non-public school parents. In Lakewood, as in the Five Towns, it may be difficult for some district residents to see a school board controlled by members who largely do not send their children to district public schools, but as Mr. Sherard noted in the quote above, the best way to fight that is to get out the vote for the candidate you support.


Anonymous Anonymous said...

"impression of isolationism" is not the problem. isolationism is the problem. orthomom - you are not being realistic if if you use the word impression. talk turkey here. you have a group of people that want to be separate and not equal, but better than, or at least that is the perception - you have an enormous problem. if a group came in and wanted to be equal and not isloationist there would be no problem. why dont you do a reality check on the demographics.

8:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And Mr Sherard from what this article says is going about it the right way. Empower yours, don't kill the other side.

10:05 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Maybe the "other side" should stay on its own private school boards.

The audacity to continue to "sway" things your way to the detriment of those entitled to excellent public schools free of the oppression that is the non-public "trustees" who show they cannot be trusted to hold this precious position. STAY ON YOUR OWN SCHOOL BOARDS AND LEAVE US ALONE - WE ARE PUT IN A POSITION TO FIGHT FOR BASIC CIVIL RIGHTS ENOUGH ALREADY.

11:27 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 8:32 Two points. First, how does the "Orthodox" community (for lack of a better term) seek a better than equal share. As far as education goes, when we send children to private school, we are ensuring ourselves a less than equal share (which if fair, appropriate, and just). Sure, many in the "orthodox" community try to maximize what they can get out of their less than equal share, but what group wouldn't? You pretend that if the "Orthodox" wanted to be isolationist but only get an equal share, "there would be no problem." Surely you don't believe that. The problem is here but I don't see how the "Orthodox" are seeking a more than equal share -- just because you say it doesn't make it so. Second, doesn't everyone self-select their friends? When churchgoers self-select fellow parishoners, are they isolationists. Of course not? When theatregoers, Met fans, Yankee fans, Oprah afficionados, knitters, stamp collecters or other ethnic groups self-select friends with similar interests are they isolationists? Of course not. But fear the "Orthodox" isolationists who choose to be friends with people with similar interests. Oh the horror.

11:34 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 11:27. "Taxation without representation is tyrany." You want me to pay taxes -- then you have to put up with my right to vote for whoever I choose. Or would you deny me that "BASIC CIVIL RIGHT"?

11:37 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Toward the end the article got quite a bit more positive. Unfortunately, most of the people i discussed it with yesterday never got that far and the first three quarters is negative.

The reporting was poor also in that it missed all the nuances of old Lakewood's being swallowed by the hoards of Brooklynese who have immigrated over the last ten years. The founders of Lakewood as a purposefully isolated Jewish world would be horrified by what has come about in the BoroParketization of Lakewood. Take the restaurant transition alone. Fifteen years ago there was not a single establishment with chairs serving food. Now men and women can eat together in numerous places. If the Times wanted to focus on the huge population shift it merely alludes to and its transformation of most aspects of the Orthodox community's sociology (never mind the arrival of all the Mexicans)they could produce something worth reading.

11:46 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bottom line is, isolationist religous schools cannot be compared to Mets fans etc.

That said, just as other religious schools are entitled to what the State LAWs govern, nothing will change by taking over our public school boards.

Vote how you wish, does not mean the LAWS of this state or nation for that matter have changed just because you win an election for "TRUSTEE".


Don't like restrictions for private school funding by public tax dollars? Send to public schools, then get the equal/fair share you desire.

11:50 AM  
Blogger Observer said...

Anon 11:50 Calm down and stop capitalizing. I didn't, in your words, compare "isolationist religous schools" "to Mets fans etc." Rather, I compared "Orthodox" people who self-select friends with common interests to other people who do so. I believe the comparison is apt. Of course the laws of this State and Nation govern. I thank God every week (and should do so everyday) for the privilege I have of living in this Nation under its enlightened laws. Amongst the freedoms and rights that I have in this great land are the right to vote for candidates of my choosing; to associate freely with people of my choosing; to engage in free and open discussion of these issues; and the right to pratice my religion as I see fit. Why does my assertion of these rights offend you?

12:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not offended, just protecting the LAWS regardless of who you "elected" to the office of PUBLIC school trustee - why do CAPS offend you?

Engage in free and open discussion, choose candidates you see fit to vote for, but do NOT think for one moment that by doing so, it gives you the right to ruin the public schools as this district has known them.

By now, if you haven't figured out that all your efforts to change the rules have not worked. In fact the opposite: so much money, time and energy has been wasted by voting in your FAILED LOBBYISTS who cannot change what this country is all about: DIVERSITY, integration and equal rights for all.

Once you choose private religious schools that not everyone is entitled to attend, you are on your own for the most part. Yes, you have the right to live that way, but the LAWS do not support that way in America.

12:48 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon: In this arena, Caps are considered to be the equivelent of shouting, and rude (From Wikipedia: "in on-line forums" all-caps "became solely identified with 'shouting' or attention-seeking behaviour. As a result, netiquette generally discourages the use of all caps"). As to the contents of your post, I haven't made any efforts to "change the rules" whatever you think them to be. I have simply excercised my franchise. Not only do I have no lobbyist, I have no interest in "chang[ing] what this country is all about." I love what this country ia all about and am proud to be an American. As to "DIVERSITY, integration and equal rights for all," I am in support of each and every one of them in the public sphere. I am curious how you distate for the "Orthodox" and NIMBY view of us meshes with your proclaimed support for diversity and integration. Or, in your view, are those important principles reserved only for groups to which you want them to apply?

1:13 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You're certifiable!

1:48 PM  
Blogger Looking Forward said...

observer, everyone is welcome in america, as long as they become an "american" and act like an america, which means shopping in kmart, eating in mcdonnalds, watchin movies in the movie theater and sending your kids to public schools so that they will act american when they grow up.

or didn't you understand that that is what they mean by "diversity" in america? diversity of color, diversity of national origin, diversity of religious identification, but g-d forbid you should live according to your religious tennents because that is
"fundementalism and not welcome in our enlightened and civilized country."


I've said it before, a holocaust could easily happen in this country if it could happen in germany. They don't care about us or our lives or beliefs for anything other than to corner votes.

2:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

First, America is always CAPITALIZED.

Second, no one questions your right as an American to live the way you do,

Third, this is about the attempted destruction of public schools all across America - a conspiracy if you will.

Lakewood, Lawrence, Crown Heights and anywhere else there is a "non-public majority on any given school board".

We public school American parents have seen your agenda first hand, not very American, but detrimental to any "non-public" citizens.

So there you have it. I feel sorry for you, you were taught that there is something wrong with American values?

2:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Meant to say detrimental to any "non-private" citizens.

2:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You missed the part of the article by the NYT on 9/16

racial disparities in special education that have been cited by the state are linked to Orthodox control of the school board.

While I don't mind my neighbors I find it ironic no problems exsist until the population shift. Perhaps its the takeover behavior, or the control issue. Either way as a jew myself it is scarry the way things are headed. With the state stepping up investigations in this district, the only ones who will loose is the non public schols. Perhaps fixing the school like promised would have gone a long way against law suits.

4:02 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You missed the part of the article by the NYT on 9/16

racial disparities in special education that have been cited by the state are linked to Orthodox control of the school board.

While I don't mind my neighbors I find it ironic no problems exsist until the population shift. Perhaps its the takeover behavior, or the control issue. Either way as a jew myself it is scarry the way things are headed. With the state stepping up investigations in this district, the only ones who will loose is the non public schols. Perhaps fixing the school like promised would have gone a long way against law suits.

4:02 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You sound like the thief who isn't sorry he stole, but is very very sorry he got caught.

4:17 PM  
Blogger Looking Forward said...

So there you have it. I feel sorry for you, you were taught that there is something wrong with American values?

I'm sorry but I learned that as an orthodox jew in public school.

noone had to teach it to me. I saw american "ideals" as the lies they are first hand.

america is NOT the righteous happy nation it claims to be. America has lots and lots of problems, and is generaly a selfish, egocentric, crybaby of a nation.

this all I learned first hand from watching public schools, noone taught it to me.

the debauchery of america's youth completely aside from the matter.

noone wants to destroy public schools. Noone, and why on earth should they? they can't get funding for their schools anyway!

So what on earth good does it do them?

and perhaps there are disparities because people are actualy being served? or perhaps because the demographics have changed creating apperant "disparities"?

the press is a poor way to find most things out.

5:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

One has to wonder if anyone actually stops and looks at what they are saying here. The labeling and stereotyping is prodigious. The logical fallacies likewise, from the "ad hominem" name calling to the faulty cause and affect reasoning. What is trying to pass as reasonable argumentation here is nothing but hot air, inflamed passion with more than a bit of anti-semitic, anti-ethnic over-the-top rhetoric.

The NYT has breached the established journalistic code of ethics, but if their intended readership is represented by the commenters thus far, they have surely gauged the tenor of those readers' minds.

The comments on what should surely be a topic of concern for all? "Full of the sound and fury, signifying nothing."

6:56 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The correct quotation (from Macbeth) is "full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."

7:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

While I will not get into the politics of busing, the Newsdays article on Albanys decision is an indication of the tone on Long Island. Please read the comments after about what people think. Very Scary


10:45 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is this news to you that this is the tone on Long Island? It is certainly the tone in District
15. Maybe the private school parents in the Five Towns should wake up and smell the coffee. You have no one to blame but yourselves for voting in this board. Do you realize how much money was wasted as a result of this bussing issue? Will the board appeal this decision and waste even more money? The board has taken these funds away from public and private school children. My tax dollars are being used to fund this issue against my will. It is so sad that there is such hostility in our community. If I could sell my house, I would.

12:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To all you public school commentators out there:

You're a bunch of parasites.

The formula cannot be any simpler -


I am tired of hearing all the complaints.

Imagine what would happen if one day every orthodox family sent their kids to public schools. We all know that taxes would have to go up substantially because the schools are not equipped to educate every kid in the district. Would you pay that extra tax with a smile?? Or would you find another reason to curse and complain about the orthodox????? This district collects millions of dollars from families who don't even use the bulk of the services those dollars pay for. And yet, all you do is complain when we take advantage of a small portion of the services we are entitled to?????

Imagine how your financial situation would look if your house value did not appreciate as much as it did over the last few years. Any person with half a brain knows that the orthodox families in this neighborhood are the SOLE reason why home prices are where they are. Are you still cursing out those orthodox when you tap into that home equity line, or when you managed to squeeze half a million dollar out of a young orthodox couple for your little shack in Cedarhurst??????

The orthodox families have contributed (and continue) to this community more than any other segment, but yet they are constantly a target for hatred and blame.
Orthodox people do not think they are better than any other segment of the community. That is a figment of your imagination. That is what you want to believe. It's a convenient theory to support your ridiculous positions against the orthodox community.

We pay the taxes, but you want to spend the money…gotta love these people.

1:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So if all the pre-school students in our dsitrict enroll in the public school pre-k program , which is open to all district students, how much will that cost the district? Could they handle the additional students?

2:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To 1:42: With all due respect, the law states that private school children are not entitled to the same benefits as public school children. I'm sorry if the truth hurts but I did not write the laws.

Additionally, don't lump all public school parents together. That's not fair. I take offense to you calling all public school parents parasites. I believe your children are entitled to whatever the law provides.

2:33 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here in Highland Park, an hour north of Lakewood, we also have Orthodox Jews subsidizing the school system. Many of the public school attendees are renters, who only indirectly pay taxes. Many of the larger homes are owned by Orthodox Jews, who pay exorbitant taxes. One could say we are subsidizing a nicer place to live, but how much should we be willing to pay? My kids' yeshiva certainly doesn't have the fancy facilities our local high school has.

2:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have to say kudos to the blogget who think all public school parents are parasites. As a public school parent paying over $17,000 a year in taxes I want it all. I want my kids to have a good education. I also want them to have modern technology and updated software to ensure their learning capacity. I want grounds that are safe and modern. I am sorry New York State and this Country, do not see your Yeshivas as equal. If you don't like it change it. Go to the legislature, but don't blame me. As a conservative Jew I cringe every time I see comments about the "jews" ruining the schools. You claim fiscal responsibility but you elect a board member who was part of the 18million dollar spendown, and who was quoted in the Herald about not worrying about money. Oh and by the way I voted against pre-k busing for two reasons. 1. At the time of the election it was said there would be no door to door stops, which I thought was dangerous, and I thought it was wrong to only offer this busing to eight Yeshivas. Also, housing prices went up everywhere, so don't say its because of you. Go to any Long Island Town and houses are out of control. If you can't afford it don't buy it. If you don't like you neighbors move, If you don't agree with the Blaine Amendment, go to another country. With your attitude you will not be missed.

3:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


Well then send your kids to public school. If your not happy with the laws change them. If you put your kids in public school my kids would welcome them with open arms. As far as paying more, no problem. Lynbrook,Hewlett,RVC all pay far more than we do. Atlantic Beach pays at least 15-20 a year. Also, think about it this way, the district would save 9m for busing, and add all the books, nurses, etc, and we would add about 11 mill. Then add state aid for a higher enrollment, and we would not pay as much as you think. Of course your kids would be eligble for homework centers if they were AT RISK FOR FAILING, otherwise they would get nothing like the rest of the kids. Enroll, please it would benefit my kids.

3:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To all you public school commentators out there:

You're a bunch of parasites

Nice, really nice. I gotta tell you should really be nice, what would happen if all the kids at the #2 school failed the ELA's christmas tree it. Title 1 school, here comes the state. Be nice, As far as equality, until they overturn Blaine, you are not entitled, key word, entitled.....

3:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Separation of church and state, this isn't a theocracy, tell your Rabi to stop telling you who to vote for.

3:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

and another thing

A right to have busing my ass. Thats why half the things you request from us are illegal, and thats why your getting fucking sued. You seriously can fucking say that your not putting your selves above other people. Blacks and Hispanics have the right to be educated. By essentially destroying the public school's budget your putting them down. The majority of them can't afford to go to private school. Think about who is being racist here. Many Hispanic's parent's can't vote, yet their children are entitled to the same public services as other citizens. Why don't you think about that you racist elitist fuck.

4:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

you can't invade a community, and expect people to sit back and trample on your rights

4:12 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Any person with half a brain knows that the orthodox families in this neighborhood are the SOLE reason why home prices are where they are.

I guess that means the house prices on Long Island all went up because of the Religous community. Interesting. I just thought it was the market. I now know the truth. I say send your kids to the schools, we get more money, save 9 million in transportation alone, and you too can reap the benefits of this years board. Don't worry about taxes we have 29 to burn. Also, being we are all parasite, perhaps we should christmas tree the ELA's then you can pay for the Legally Required Academic interventions Services. You think your taxes are high now, wait.

9:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think the Orthodox have come into the 5 Towns and essentially "assaulted" our institutions (ie. schools), that are crucially important and cherished by the community. I think the best way to fight back is to have a grass roots movement that will do the same to their institutions. We all know that the Orthodox don't want to integrate. We should support social integration with other members of the town of all races. We should have people from other religions attend services in their synagogues. The Orthodox want to use the public school ball fields? Okay, then we should have ALL children play together in the same little leagues. Longtime members of the 5 towns, should not put up with this segregation nonsense. There should be peaceful protest. We should not let the 5 towns become a place like IRAQ, where religious beliefs divide a community. I want to see a grass roots movement started to combat religious division in the town and in public institutions. Maybe then, the Orthodox will respect our cherished institutions.

5:58 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

you are on to something...
I like the idea of a grass roots

8:53 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

can you repost the link, part was cut off and I cannot find it.

9:09 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

-- Anonymous said...
you are on to something...
I like the idea of a grass roots

8:53 AM --

Uh grass....Grass is goooooood!

7:13 AM  
Blogger Looking Forward said...

as I said, you can only like us if we are just like you.

some loving and tollerant country this is.


8:24 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

8:25 AM  
Blogger J. "יהוא בן יהושפט בן נמשי" Izrael said...

This is a much wider issue than presented here, with many ramifications.

First off, Five Towns is more akin to the situation in Ramapo (Monsey, Spring Valley, New Hempstead, Wesley Hills, Pomona, Airmont etc) where many Ortho Jews moved in to a rich area, unlike Lakewood which for a long time now is a poor town populated by blacks & illegal immigrants.

As long as the Jews in Ramapo were rather stable and didn't oiverbuild, there were no problems. Businesses enjoyed the large families patronage, there was economic growth. At that point it was kinda unfair that Jews who sent their kids to private schools at their own expens also paid lots of taxes for public schools - a PS kid costs 11 to 18 grand a year.

But when hassidim started to move in indroves in the early '80es, things started to change. The bloc vote was appealing to politicians - especially the spineless leftists, and with it cam down-zoning, building irregularities and white-collar crime to which the vote recipients turn a blind eye. Add to this the out-of-control reliance of many OJ's on gov't assistance, from single-mom benefits to getting sec 8 for a house you own, and you get pandemonium. The great differnce is that here the community at large is still an accomplice in the profiteering - all building material industries etc are in the hands of locals, as well as stores etc, and the ration of F/T kollel and non-working hassidim is to professionals and businessmen is far more balanced than in Laewood, which consists mostly of Yeshivaleit. Also in Lakewood where there was scant business to begin with, the locals' benefits are nearly zero, they only see Jews who learn all day build fancy houses on gov't money and own all businesses. And the influx of illegals brought in b/c of employment by the OJ community (instead of employing local blacks) also takes its toll. The blacks are disadvantaged even vis-a-vis the illegals, who get free education, meidcaid etc, just for swimming across the Rio Grande.

So it's complicated. The solution is for all sides to be honest, admit their faults and do the right thing.
An unlikely scenario.

10:10 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I truly believe the legislation will step in and pass a bill to protect our public schools. They did it for Rampapo, when they passes legislation. Also, I am afraid what will happen when this fiscally irresponsible board once again spends another 250,000 on appeals. The parents of this community will be asking the district attorney have them arrested for grand theft. They are stealing our childrens futures, all of them(except marcus and Blisko) how can you be mad at people who are not allowed to speak.

2:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

" Anonymous said...

I truly believe the legislation will step in and pass a bill to protect our public schools. They did it for Rampapo, when they passes legislation."

Um, do you have any idea how much in the way of services Ramapo provides for their private school students?? On a much lower per student budget than our district.

2:58 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Um, do you have any idea how much in the way of services Ramapo provides for their private school students

Um do you know how the legislature passed new legislation to prevent the religous community from pulling the crap.

8:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rampapo does not provide pre-k busing. Ramapo has a transportation budget only 5% of the total budget with more students than our 11% transportation budget.

9:06 PM  
Blogger nikki said...

anon 5.58

heads up! there have always been orthodox jews living in the 5t. it's just a matter of where on the spectrum they fell, and how visible they were. the newbies identify as more rightwing than modern and therefore more visible. but orthodox jewry is certainly not a new phenomena.

9:12 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yeah..there were always Orthodox Jews in the 5 towns, but they were neighborly, friendly, and didnt act like jerks. The new influx of people are close minded, self-centered, and give Jews a bad name. They are like the Taliban. We wont let this community become like Iraq. We are going to start a grass roots movement that will eradicate it. You will see.

12:40 PM  
Blogger nikki said...

We are going to start a grass roots movement that will eradicate it.

wow. for someone who is so afraid of the talibanization of the south shore, you sure sound just like them. rather like certain despotic elements in my part of the world.

4:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

if you want to eradicate it, make a city ordinance that all women need to dress in swim suits durring the day.

that will almost assuredly drive the heredim out.

(not that I think this is ethical or would even vaguely consider doing this my self.)

to them the only thing worse than this would be to encourage your daughters to associate with the yeshiva boys, and to introduce them to all kinds of things.

and boys being boys will reciprocate, and even if you can't ge6t rid of the people who are there, the boys'll go off the derech, and no other heredi jew will settle within ten miles of this place.

8:19 PM  
Blogger Commenter Abbi said...

OMom- Don't you think it's time to close up shop? You don't seem very interested in monitoring comments or posting regularly, just throwing a bone once a week that attracts destructive minds who have nothing better to do then spew anti-semitic crap. Not sure what you're trying to accomplish with this.

You don't seem very interested anymore, so why not just bid your readers a polite adieu, rather then leaving the space open to hate-mongering hounds?

6:57 AM  
Blogger orthomom said...

The hatemongering hounds were as far - if not far more in evidence when I have the time to post more regularly. Also, I absolutely do monitor comments, but I tend not to delete comments based on hatefulness alone.

But thanks for the suggestion.

9:03 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


There is an answer to the hatred being expressed here. That answer is Jesus Christ and you can censor these posts but you cannot alter the truth that Yeshua brings peace to every heart that receives Him.

So today I implore each one of you to repent of your unbelief, receive Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour, and enter into a new relationship with Hakodosh Borchu!

Wishing you an easy Taanis this Wednesday,

Rabbi Neal Abraham Wendrow

4:09 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So orthomom, "hate mongering hounds" or teenagers looking for a reaction you JEW, destructive minds for the win!

5:30 PM  
Blogger Looking Forward said...

mr. wendrow, are you happy being an idolterer?

6:57 PM  
Blogger hartfield zody said...

You non Orthos are all evious since your chilren are all intermarried or no longer intrested in reform or Conservative Judaism and are now unaffiliated.

when you see us you are jelous.Keep on makeing those stupid comments

12:07 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Brother Halfnutcase:

I scarcely believe that by putting my faith in the authentic Moshiach of Klal Yisroel I'm an idolator. By receiving Yeshua I have received the fulfillment of Hashem in all His glory just as surely as Avraham Avinu did.

Your dear friend-Rabbi Neal

10:27 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

2:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

5:18 PM  
Blogger orthomom said...

Anon 5:18:

Deleted yours too as per your request but thanks for a sorely needed laugh.

6:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

this is 5:18
glad I got the result I was looking for, and in turn you gave me a good laugh too!!
now back to work, and remember to laugh whenever you can:)

12:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear friend-Rabbi Neal,
I advise you to stick your faith as far up your ass as you can and enjoy the feeling. In this you'll be joining all those lovely catholic priests who can't keep their hands off the alter boys.

4:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

this is again for you orthomom, i want to point POLS out at the rabbi in the tax evasion scheme, and i am requesting a blog entry about this

5:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

sorry, not POLS, LOLS*

5:13 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Honest Christian,

I advise you to sincerely repent of your filthliness and ask Jesus to forgive you. It is clear your heart has not been recreated by Him!

12:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Pamela, is that you out there....spewing all the hatred????

1:31 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The comments here are absolutely insane. I cant believe what I am reading...

Are these people for real?

Not one orthodox person has an interest in harming the public school children. You are a bigot looking to blame someone because you are unsatisfied about the natural demographic change in the neighborhood (a change you definitely are benefiting from - e.g. flourishing commerce, high valued homes, low crime and clean neighbors...)

I understand you're all frustrated just because you're no longer in the majority, but truth be told you created the animosity that exists. Orthodox people do not have an interest in "controlling" the public schools. They simply want to end the "Blank Check" era of a school board that was spending recklessly because it had an incredible amount of excess funds due to the fact that the overwhelming majority of taxpayer no longer used the services they were paying for.

The law states loud and clear that taxpayers in the district are entitled to minimal benefits. For years orthodox people were footing the bill without any representation. When the orthodox started asking for the services they are entitled to by LAW, they were faced with rejection and a discriminatory attitude by those in charge. That is why you lost the board and why you will continue to lose the board.

Furthermore, all this nonsense about bussing and books is absolutely ridiculous. Those numbers represent a small fraction (even 25% is considered small) of the entire budget. How can you justify unnecessary expenses like a bowling team at Lawrence high school while simultaneously denying essential benefits entitled by the private sector under the LAW???????

Nobody hates you. Orthodox simply want minimal respect and benefits they are entitled to (nobody is asking for anything beyond their entitlement under the law). After all, they are the ones who foot most of the bill.

If you're not happy with the neighborhood, feel free to sell your home and move elsewhere. I am sure you can find some innocent young orthodox couple you can take advantage of by selling them your tiny little house for half a million dollars.... those damn orthodox...

1:47 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear friend-Rabbi Neal,
it's not Jesus I'm against, it's assholes like you. You J4J are so full of shit, I can fertilize me lawn with you.
You give all Christians a bad name and a black eye to the Church of our Lord. Your blasphemy will not go unpunished.

2:53 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Furthermore, all this nonsense about bussing and books is absolutely ridiculous. Those numbers represent a small fraction (even 25% is considered small) of the entire budget. How can you justify unnecessary expenses like a bowling team at Lawrence high school while simultaneously denying essential benefits entitled by the private sector under the LAW???????

you don't seem to understand the most important thing about sports teams in the public school system. students frequently get scholarship money to colleges and universities because of their sports involvement. secular colleges and universities also are looking for well rounded students that participate in sports as well as other after school activities. bowling might be way low on your priority list and seem very unimportant to you and your life, but to a high school senior looking for admission to college and scholorships, something as seemingly unimportant as bowling can be of the utmost importance.

3:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

whats up w/ a local rabbi buying a house for 1.8m??? is he Z. rabbi or a businessman??? first time ive heard of a rabbi treating the rabbinate like a biz!

4:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

11:22 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is this site going on hiatus? Seems to be no posting going on.

7:44 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

8:38 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Is this site going on hiatus? Seems to be no posting going on."

Well, Orthomom can't criticize the BOE anymore. I suppose they are no longer deserving of scrutiny. Why she isn't posting more about other issues I couldn't tell you other than to say that she just may be devoting more time to her life and family.

10:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Miss you, Orthomom!

11:31 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who gives the flying fuck!

1:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

10:13 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

your paying your taxes just like everyone else, and choice not to go to the library, or put your garbarge out 4 times a week, does not mean you get a discount.
IF you are entitled under law for services, you are entitled.
If the district fought you and won, that means you lost because you were not entitled.
You want a loan for $3 million dollars, however you are only entitled to $2 million dollars, jump up and down and ask the bank for more money,HA- is what they will say.
Every public school district has to answer to the State of NY, on how and where they spend the money.
The board spending money on 6 students going to Kulanu is going to come back and bite them. Why? Our district has a wonderful special ed program, in district, without the cost of a private school. Why that private school, only because of the religious portion?? The State doesnot want to hear about anyone's wants, they only care about the NEED of the students, and in district (public school) is the least restricted, placement.
Next, the placement would be another school district, then BOCES, the last resort is a private school.
We as a district donot get any money back from the State for private schools.
By the board getting involved and approving the placements, overriding the CSE committee, they have really opened a can of worms.
Many times we have placed students in private schools, thank G-d for them, most are out of state, 24 hour- in resident.
Oh and by the way, find out about real Public High Schools, picking on a bowling team is pretty petty, considering almost all high schools have them.
EDUCATE YOURSELVE, do your own research and find out what you really are entitled too, by stating only the ortho pay and donot get extra services, well how many residents donot even have students in any schools, they are still paying their taxes and not whining about the bowling team.

10:26 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

10:26 While your technical comments are correct, your political ones are not.

The ortho's could not get the election victories on their own. The seniors and others who are unhappy with taxes helped out. While it is the ortho's who started the battle they do have many supporters. Remember 2 years ago when 35% of all LI districts budgets failed. was that the LPS ortho"s??

10:56 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It seems that OM's anticlimactic legal victory has sapped her desire to continue blogging. By losing the battle, Ms. Greenbaum appears to have won the war.

Publish or perish.

11:49 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

interesting article about yeshivas not wanting classified students.


page one - left hand side

seems that yeshivas are not welcoming to certain students

2:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

public schools educate EVERYONE, regardless of race, creed, ethnic origin, academic ability, ability to learn, EVERYONE. the mom should not bemoan the fact that her son is in public school, but rather be delighted that he is getting a good education without having to take medications that she was uncomfortable with.

2:34 PM  
Blogger YMedad said...

Hello? Hellooooo?

3:46 PM  
Blogger -suitepotato- said...

It is the basic ethical and moral duty of anyone with any power to effect society to use that power for not only their own benefit, but that of society, to the best egalitarian fairness they can muster in the best balancing of interests be they short or long term.

The only differences are going to be method of implementation in accordance with political/social ideas of what is the best way to do it. In a perfect world that is.

In our imperfect world, we have people who disenfranchise themselves for various reasons. Black and Hispanic groups tend to do so because for untold decades they've either been sold hopelessness from racists or they've been sold hopelessness by their supposed saviors. Charedi Orthodox Jews tend to do so because of the inherent idea that Jews are different and on multiple levels should remain apart.

One stays away politically, the other doesn't. The result is out of balance influence, however it is a result of not taking part, NOT being kept out. You can lead a horse to water and all applies. A natural result is that with one side not being adequately heard from is that those in power tend to govern in their own interests more than anything else.

However, what I said at the outset of this reply bears being kept in mind by those who would aspire to a claim of moral superiority in any way: you must represent your fellow man with your vote, not just yourself. It cannot be done in a patronizing condescending way. Liberal whites who claim to be representing minorities have been doing it that way for decades and you can see the results.

Since the majority of those administering the public schools send their children to private schools, the duty must be doubly stressed. Their job is NOT to protect themselves and their interest group but to represent the interests of public school children across the board. "What is right" on a basic human level.

As long as they do so properly, there are no problems. However, I agree with Warren Sherard that the people not feeling represented should then get involved. Of course, the same idea applies: they cannot be provincial once in the political process but must balance the needs of all.

If people followed that, all else might be more easily taken care of. Sadly, our world rarely works that way and we're poorer for it.

2:35 PM  
Blogger duhdduh said...

Bottom line is not all jewish people are bad this is coming from someone who lived among them all my life.On that note not one ever said good morning or hi or anything.They are masters of ripping off the state of there funds.most of them dont work we pay for that with our taxes they attend private schools witch i pay for.some dont pay taxes at all why cause i pay them for them.For all i do for the jews in lakewood you would think that i love them and want to be one.Well ill just take a hello 36years and still waiting.PS i woudnt mind coughing up some mony for driving lessons for them.Loard knowa they need it.oh and clean up your yards.Oh and keep picking up those hookers on rt9 that will get you closer to heven.

4:42 PM  
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