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Thursday, October 05, 2006

Relief from Duties On Grounds of Intolerance?

I think this is a terrible idea:
London's police chief on Thursday launched an urgent review of a decision not to post a Muslim officer at the Israeli embassy after a newspaper reported that he had been excused on moral grounds.

PC Alexander Omar Basha, who is attached to the force's Diplomatic Protection Group, objected to being posted to protect Israel's embassy in central London from possible terrorist attack because he disagreed with the country's bombing of Lebanon during the recent war.

According to British newspaper 'the Guardian', the officer had reportedly attended a recent anti-war protest.

Police chiefs excused Basha last week but critics said they feared it would open the floodgates for officers of any religion or belief to refuse to carry out certain duties.
Sorry, but how does this policy make any sense at all? The question here is not whether the police officer in question agrees with the political views of the people he protects, but simply whether the parties need his protection. To set a precedent of excusing an officer from his job because his views are divergent with his charges is very dangerous indeed. Where would the line be drawn? Would an US police officer who holds anti-war views be allowed to opt off motorcade duty during a visit to his city by President Bush? I can't imagine one even making such a request, much less it being entertained. More poignantly and less hypothetically, who can forget the tears running down the faces of the Chayalim who were forced by duty's call to evacuate settlers from Gaza last summer, even if some of the soldiers disagreed with the entire disengagement process? Or, in the words of a former British police officer:
John O'Connor, a former Metropolitan Police flying squad commander, told the London-based Sun newspaper: "This is the beginning of the end for British policing."

"If they can allow this, surely they'll have to accept a Jewish officer not wanting to work at an Islamic national embassy. Will Catholic cops be let off working at Protestant churches? Where will it end? This decision is going to allow officers to work in a discriminating and racist way," he added.
I completely agree. To allow one such special dispensation out of concern for an officer's intolerance (or, to put it euphemistically, his "political views") is clearing the road for all sorts of intolerant (or politically motivated) requests to be considered. Not a direction I would want to see any police force heading in the year 2006.

105 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Welcome to your apartheid state.

9:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Please explain - surely you're not referring to the state of Israel where police and ems workers protect and provide medical and other care to Jewish and Arab citizens indiscriminately. I hope I am misunderstanding your post.

10:55 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

where police and ems workers protect and provide medical and other care to Jewish and Arab citizens indiscriminately

How magnanimous.

According to the New Israel Fund:

* only 3.7 percent of Israel's federal employees are Arabs
* Arabs hold only 50 out of 5,000 university faculty positions
* of the country's 61 poorest towns, 48 are Arab

Nope, no discrimination there.


"One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail."

Rabbi Yaacov Perrin, at the funeral of Baruch Goldstein

11:23 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

First, the New Israel Fund statistics are not reflective of discrimination per se. They reflect the demographics of the country and say nothing about purported discrimination against Israeli Arabs.

Notably, these de facto statistics you post also say nothing about legitimized or even tolerated bigotry among public service employees (the actual topic we're discussing) towards Israeli Arabs. Got anything on point about that? Interesting how the details of stats are glossed over by the bleeding hearts who defend the impoverished, suffering Arabs in Israel.

Here's a project for you: compare the distinctions you've noted to the distinctions in lifestyles between Saudi royalty and the huddled Arab masses in Saudi Arabia. Must be anti-Arab racism - right?

And let's not forget the ultra-lavish lifestyles of the typical Israeli living in some tenement in, say, Haifa (did you miss the "stylish" buildings pictured in the press during the Hezbollah bombings this summer), or the typical religious Jewish family stuffing a family of 6 or more in a 3-room apartment. The breath of your knowledge about Israel is remarkable indeed.

Second, your quote from some rabbi has no bearing on my statements regarding institutionalized discrimination in, for example, the police force or the emergency services. Let's stick to the point - OM was posting about a British police officer - NOT the personal views of Muslim clerics in Britain - which, I dare say, would be just as "racist" as that of the rabbi you quote.

You'll need a far broader knowledge of the mid-east before you engage in any debate about what's fair or reasonable in Israel or anywhere else in the mid-east.

Have you ever actually been to Israel or Gaza? Get back to me after your first trip there. Hope you don't get caught in a bus bombing - good luck explaining to the poor freedom fighter with the nail-laiden explosives whose side you're on before he explodes next to you and you find your legs on a nearby tree.

Got any stats on how many Israelis have pulled a stunt like that?

-Anon 10:55

11:50 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Whew! Someone has been drinking the ADL Kool-Aid.

Have you ever actually been to Israel or Gaza?

Have you ever been to the moon? No? Then I don't want to hear you ever talking about it.

If everybody is "equal" in Israel, why then is it necessary to identify who is Jewish and who is not on identification documents? cough, Pretoria, cough.

12:10 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's a project for you: compare the distinctions you've noted to the distinctions in lifestyles between Saudi royalty and the huddled Arab masses in Saudi Arabia.

Have you ever been to Saudia Arabia? No? I guess you shouldn't be talking about it.

12:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yay democracy!

12:18 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You're on to something, anon 12:10. Israel's master plan to gas the Arabs in a mass crematoria. That's why hundreds of ground troops are sent to cherry-pick the bad guys instead of massively bombing Lebanon - right?

As for your moon anology - right on. The subtleties of religious and nationalistic passions, super-power influence and the oil industry (to name a few) are exactly like an amorphous mass of rock that we use, essentially, for satellite reception. Brilliant. Kudos the school system you attended (public, no doubt?) for the stellar education you must have received.

12:18 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great comeback, anon 12:11. Care to make a substantive attempt at responding to my non-factitious arguments, or have you taken a moment to look in the mirror at the mindless sheep you are. Educate yourself with some real facts and then come back for a productive conversation.

12:25 PM  
Blogger sheva7777 said...

I don't know if it's one or more of you so I don't know who to address this to, but this is to the bleeding heart anti-Israel anonymous commenter(s)...

Are you serious???? If Arabs would stop blowing themselves and Israelis up ther may not be a need for differenciations on ID cards. The fact is that Israel has to have a way to protect its citizens. Stick a Jew in an Arab country and see what happens to him! How many government jobs do you think he will qualify for? Forget Jewish...let a woman apply for a job in some of those countries and see how many she will be offered.

And since when did this discussion become about Israel and its employment? Aren't we talkng about the blatent racism of the Moslem police officer? And the pathetic response from the police force? And the fact that he was not only not fired, but was told it's ok...you don't have to work there.

Again, give me a break!

12:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You're on to something, anon 12:10. Israel's master plan to gas the Arabs in a mass crematoria

Nice job of Godwining the thread!

You forgot to mention that every critic is an anti-Semite or self-hating Jew.

12:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

or have you taken a moment to look in the mirror at the mindless sheep you are

You're projecting.

12:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Aren't we talkng about the blatent racism of the Moslem police officer?

We're also talking about the casual racism in Israel.

12:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wrong, again, anon 12:25. I attack only your blatant ignorance - not one mention of anti-Semitism or self-loathing in my post. Got a guilty conscience?

12:28 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Stick a Jew in an Arab country and see what happens to him!

Jews actually managed to live and thrive in Arab lands until the land grab of '48.

12:29 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi,

Sorry this is a bit unrelated but after reading your post I figured you might be interested in checking this out. I came across this site that looks identical to the Go Army recruitment site, but instead it's promoting the new survivor. It's apparently based on a documentary film based on 2 american soldiers. The link is below, you should check it out if you're interested.
http://bigbert.vfs.com/~dd06jeff/survivor
Stacey
-Canada

12:29 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I attack only your blatant ignorance - not one mention of anti-Semitism or self-loathing in my post

Like I said, you forgot to mention it.

/just trying to help

12:31 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Got a guilty conscience?

I'm not the one with a "whites only" restroom in my house.

12:33 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jews actually managed to live and thrive in Arab lands until the land grab of '48

Are you kidding me? At this point I just feel sorry for you - you are truly embarrasing yourself. You do know that Jews were persecuted in those Arab lands, as well as kicked out of those countries en masse whenever it struck the whimsy of the powers that be. And today Jews are not even allowed entrance into many Arab countries. Read some books, go online, and try to find some unbiased sources of historical information before making broad statements about Jews thriving under Arab rule. In the rare cases that happened, it was in spite of - not because of - Muslim intolerance and persecution.

12:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm not the one with a "whites only" restroom in my house.

What the hell are you talking about?

12:39 PM  
Blogger sheva7777 said...

Whoever this anonymous poster is...he is surely either off his rocker or just trying to stir the pot. THe back-and-forth on this is becoming ridiculous and childish. Are we insulting each other or having a discussion?

12:48 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And today Jews are not even allowed entrance into many Arab countries

And today, some Arabs are not even allowed in Israel. Have you ever heard of the Nationality and Entry into Israel Law? Under this law, Israelis who marry Palestinians are barred from bringing their spouses to live in the country. Incidentally, this law only applies to Palestinian husbands or wives.

/ Jim Crow lives!
// Must stop the "interbreeding"

12:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Are you serious???? If Arabs would stop blowing themselves and Israelis up ther may not be a need for differenciations on ID cards.

You're right. Only Arabs are terrorists.

cough Baruch Goldstein cough

12:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What the hell are you talking about?

Do people have to show an ID to use the restroom in your house?

12:58 PM  
Blogger sheva7777 said...

yes, you are right. Israel teaches are its youth that they should be just like Baruch Goldstein because when they die they will get 40 virgins. They teach that in gan and cheder and mamlachti schools. it's in the textbooks. you are right. Israeli mothers are excited about their children being martyrs.

1:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's a link to an article about that law:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,,1774797,00.html

Note the part that states:

"The president of the court, Aharon Barak, described the law as an infringement of human rights but was outvoted by six to five. The majority of judges agreed with the state prosecution, which argued that it was appropriate to limit human rights in order to enhance Israel's security."

Do you think debate like this would be allowed in any Arab country, or would the dissenters be beheaded before they had a chance to appear in court?

Why do you insist on only accusing Israelis of being racist, when it's clear that whatever extreme measures they have to employ in the face of incessant terrorism is stongly opposed by many Israelis themselves, and is far less extreme than the measures employed by Arab governments against Jews, women, and dissenters of every stripe? What exactly is your agenda in refusing to at least acknowledge that there are 2 sides to this debate?

1:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And to second Sheva7777, that Baruch Goldstein is the ONLY example Israel-bashers can point to of extreme, deranged fanaticism by an Israeli is rather telling.

1:05 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And to second Sheva7777, that Baruch Goldstein is the ONLY example Israel-bashers can point to of extreme, deranged fanaticism by an Israeli is rather telling.

Well, yes, if you don't count Yigal Amir.

1:07 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Do people have to show an ID to use the restroom in your house?

You are completely deranged. I will not respond further to insane rantings and insinuations of this nature.

1:07 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, yes, if you don't count Yigal Amir

Well, not exactly - he killed an Israeli. I didn't mention him since I figured by your logic, he should be lauded as some form of martyr - right? Surely the ends should justify the means . . .

1:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Do you think debate like this would be allowed in any Arab country, or would the dissenters be beheaded before they had a chance to appear in court?

Wow, a debate in a democracy. How magnanimous of them.

1:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Pathetic.

1:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ah, so if Israel declared itself a dictatorship or a monarchy you'd have no problem with its policies? And that's why it's ok for Arab countries to persecute women, adulterers, Jews, dissenters. Now I understand your reasoning. Excellent logic.

1:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I didn't mention him since I figured by your logic, he should be lauded as some form of martyr - right?

Why would he be a martyr?

You're right though. Israelis never attack Arabs.

1:16 PM  
Blogger sheva7777 said...

like I said ...either off his rocker or just trying to stir the pot.

I go with the former

1:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And that's why it's ok for Arab countries to persecute women, adulterers, Jews, dissenters.

Did someone say that it's OK for Arab countries.

/ Two wrongs don't make a right

1:18 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Israeli Soldier kills four Arab bus passengers

/ I guess they had the wrong identity documents

1:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 1:16 - did you even READ the article you attach?? It's talking about "attack" by water balloons and pencils. Sort of what my 2nd grader faces during recess. You're hilarious - keep on posting - you make it easy to make you look stupid.

1:20 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You are completely deranged. I will not respond further to insane rantings and insinuations of this nature.

I take it that "insane rantings" is your code word for "truth."

1:21 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And here's Ariel Sharon's response to the bus attack:

"Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon condemned the attack, calling it "a reprehensible act of a bloodthirsty Jewish terrorist who sought to attack innocent Israeli citizens."

All you do is prove that such actions are reprehensible to Israelis, no matter who commits them. But wait, your response - let me help you:

"Condemning deadly attacks . . . how magnanomous . . ."

Since I've saved you the response time, go f*** yourself, and yes, you ARE an anti-Semite.

1:23 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 1:16 - did you even READ the article you attach??

You should give reading comprehension a try sometime. the kids who were throwing the rocks....

/ remember the first intifada
// remember how people use to defend Israeli soldiers
/// who shot rock throwers

1:23 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Since I've saved you the response time, go f*** yourself, and yes, you ARE an anti-Semite.

Bravo! Thank you for not mentioning the Holocaust, Hitler, crematoria and Nazis.

1:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I go with the former

My guess is that insanity resonates with you.

1:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bravo! Thank you for not mentioning the Holocaust, Hitler, crematoria and Nazis.


Your point exactly? Let's get to the heart of your beef with Jews. Holocaust never happened, right?

1:27 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Your point exactly? Let's get to the heart of your beef with Jews. Holocaust never happened, right?

What is up with your fetish for "identity" cards?

1:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

huh?

1:31 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Israeli mothers are excited about their children being martyrs.

You're right, Israelis don't indoctrinate their kids to hate.

1:35 PM  
Blogger sheva7777 said...

if you looked closely you would see what the girl wrote. Do you actually read this stuff or do you just hear something that might possibly be anti-Israel and automatically agree. Don't you see a difference between children dressed up as suicide bombers with machine guns in their hands and children writing on a missile "to Nasralla with love from the Israeli children"

1:41 PM  
Blogger sheva7777 said...

if you looked closely you would see what the girl wrote. Do you actually read this stuff or do you just hear something that might possibly be anti-Israel and automatically agree. Don't you see a difference between children dressed up as suicide bombers with machine guns in their hands and children writing on a missile "to Nasralla with love from the Israeli children"

1:41 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Israeli mothers are excited about their children being martyrs.

You're right, Israelis don't indoctrinate their kids to hate.


You are posting "facts" and "quotes" from another BLOG, no less! Terrific work - you should apply for a job with a Palestinian PR company. A BLOG - you idiot - as much credibility as the drivle being exchanged right here. It's people opinions, and unverified photos, that could have been doctored and misquoted and simply made up, as you well know. At least stick with the bbc articles that have some basis in reality. Are you getting so desperate attempting to veil your hate and bigotry in "fact" that you've sunk to quoting other blogs as your data source??!! Go back to Maury or Springer or whatever the hell else people like you do for entertainment. I hear there's an episode on skinheads - perhaps you'll find a long-lost sibling.

1:46 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"to Nasralla with love from the Israeli children"

Have you ever seen children playing around ordnance? It's so cute!

1:47 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You are posting "facts" and "quotes" from another BLOG, no less!

You're right, the photos are totally fake.

1:48 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Are you getting so desperate attempting to veil your hate and bigotry in "fact" that you've sunk to quoting other blogs as your data source??!!

/ hyperlinks != quotes
// thank you. drive thru please.

1:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This photo from Der Spiegel looks real to me.

/ Sorry, to use a German source
// Please don't call me a nazi
/// Or Hitler's spawn

1:58 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Love your sources. Query what kind of source includes only photos conveying half a war. Since you seem fond of photos, here's one from Reuter's:

http://www.jr.co.il/terror/israel/2006/ter4360.jpg

2:10 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's another. Israeli blood everywhere. If this doesn't give you hard-on, I don't know what will.
http://www.jr.co.il/terror/israel/2006/ter4370.jpg

2:12 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's another - a zakah member - y'know - the filthy hassids that Hitler didn't get, collecting Israeli flesh right after a bombing. Mmmm, mmmm, good . . .

http://www.jr.co.il/terror/israel/2006/ter4380.jpg

2:15 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

More Israeli blood (you're right - this is fun once you get into it). And funny how many reputable sources - like Reuter's and the Associated Press - have photos of Israeli victims. I don't even have to resort to a German-language news source or an undocumented blog:

http://www.jr.co.il/terror/israel/2006/ter4328.jpg

2:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Where would the line be drawn?"

slippery slope seems to be your favorite argument. youre quite the harbinger of fear.

2:36 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's another - a zakah member - y'know - the filthy hassids that Hitler didn't get, collecting Israeli flesh right after a bombing. Mmmm, mmmm, good . . .

Godwin!

/ At least you didn't call me a Holocaust denier

2:51 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's another. Israeli blood everywhere.

What did you expect? It's take a lot of blood, sweat, tears, energy and U.S. dollars to treat a million people like 2nd class citizens.

2:53 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

don't even have to resort to a German-language news source

Because we know that all Germans are evil. Nope, there cannot be such a thing as a good German.

2:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Since you seem fond of photos, here's one from Reuter's:

Could you at least provide hyperlinks?

/ You have no HTML skillz
// Noob

2:56 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Check out this race card.

2:59 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What did you expect? It's take a lot of blood, sweat, tears, energy and U.S. dollars to treat a million people like 2nd class citizens.

Get a clue. Apartheid is not good for Israel.

3:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Membership has it privileges.

/ Avoid hassles at checkpoints
// Get your Yehudi card today!

3:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Something for you to think in connection with this Godwin thing you keep waving like a punchline: YOU'RE the one who first raised the issue of anti-semitism; YOU'RE the one waving the Holocaust banner like it's some kind of joke. Clearly, neither me nor anyone else on this blog can convince you to open your mind just a little and realize that as much as there is violence in the mid-east, surely it can't ALL be Israel's fault. You simply won't see that because you don't want to. But do realize, in some corner of your narrow mind, that your excrutiating effort to make Godwin some overriding principle to excuse your unjustified Israel-bashing does not justify your irrational arguments in anyone's mind but your own. I urge you to re-read everything you've posted, and the inane sources you've made your bible for blaming Israel for all the ills of the mid-east and reconsider your inability to view things with a more even-handed perspective. A bit of tolerance makes for a much more pleasant life.

3:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

YOU'RE the one who first raised the issue of anti-semitism; YOU'RE the one waving the Holocaust banner like it's some kind of joke.

Nope, it started here:

You're on to something, anon 12:10. Israel's master plan to gas the Arabs in a mass crematoria. That's why hundreds of ground troops are sent to cherry-pick the bad guys instead of massively bombing Lebanon - right?

The Holocaust is a joke? I think not. 11 million people died in it. Unfortunately, six million had the "wrong" identity on their papers.

4:03 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

surely it can't ALL be Israel's fault

No kidding. Who said it was all of Israel's fault?

4:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A bit of tolerance makes for a much more pleasant life.

That and the right "identity" papers too.

4:05 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Something for you to think in connection with this Godwin thing you keep waving like a punchline:

I bring up Godwin to counter an old and busted guilt trip.

4:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why the obsession with identity papers? This is ludicrous. Every country has its own ID system. My recent ID papers for entry to France were no less invasive. And I was asked a litany of questions about my religion the last time I - a visibly observant Jew - entered Israel. If anything, this ID process is being applied without discrimination. If people's underwear is being scanned, and their toothpaste confiscated, why the silly focus on the ID papers? Seriously - what's this really about? Your focus is truly puzzling. I've had my 4 year-old flagged as a security risk on Jetblue - you don't see me crying racism. You can't truly be this insanely focused on an ID card or the ridiculous smiling photos of newly nationalized immigrants (presumably - there's absolutely no other identifying caption on the photo) that you've linked to your posts as proof of sinister plot. Were you violated by an ID card as a youth? What's your real issue here?

4:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Every country has its own ID system

Yes, but how many "democracies" have internal ID cards with the word "Negro" or "Chink" on them?

If you are privileged to be an American citizen, such a thing is unimaginable in this day and age.

4:29 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I've had my 4 year-old flagged as a security risk on Jetblue

In the U.S., we are not screened based on our race or religion for the purposes of security.

4:33 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Were you violated by an ID card as a youth? What's your real issue here?

No, but I would expect a nation that rose out of the ashes of a major genocide -- facilitated by what was on their identity cards -- to have a special sensitivity to this sort of thing.

4:36 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes, but how many "democracies" have internal ID cards with the word "Negro" or "Chink" on them?

If you are privileged to be an American citizen, such a thing is unimaginable in this day and age.


And your point is . . . ? Is there some slur for Palestinian on the Israeli ID card? Or do Palestinians only want to be identified as such when it suits their purposes - namely - to deny the existence of the state of Israel.

4:41 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

In the U.S., we are not screened based on our race or religion for the purposes of security.

bs. That's the party line. Check out the number of dark-skinned 20-somethings being screened next time you're in the airport. You conveniently choose the discriminatory actions that suit your arguments.

4:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

No, but I would expect a nation that rose out of the ashes of a major genocide -- facilitated by what was on their identity cards -- to have a special sensitivity to this sort of thing.

Again, your point is lost. Palestinians don't walk around with their ID cards like some yellow star, and they aren't sent to gas chambers based on their religion. You may argue that Israelis perpetrate similar atrocities on Arabls, but you'd be dead wrong. The instructions of the Israeli army, and the political leanings of most Israelis, is to sympathize heavily with the plight of the Palestinians - and, at great risk to Israeli life - to try and minimize discrimination towards Arabs. This is fact - not fiction - so please don't bombard this blog with a plethora of pitiful photos in response. If you know anything about mainstream Israelis today, other than right after a major terrorist attack, they're overly sympathetic and conscious of not being the perpetrators of racism towards Arabs. You've simply got your facts wrong. You need to educate yourself about this stuff from reputable sources.

4:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is there some slur for Palestinian on the Israeli ID card?

No. But how would you like it if most of the people in the U.S. has "White Christian" stamped on their ID?

bs. That's the party line.

I'd like to see the TSA training session where African-American screeners are told to screen only "dark-skinned" people. I'm sure that would go over well.

4:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Palestinians don't walk around with their ID cards like some yellow star

They don't have to wear it on their clothes? How magnanimous.

But they'll need to show their ID to get a job, right? How convenient. Not only that, but the "right" ID can get you in the army. Army service gets you on the path to a decent job. A friend's kid has resigned himself to having to join the Israeli Army for that very reason.

5:00 PM  
Anonymous Dinky said...

Booooooring! And there was I thinking that those 80 comments were actually discussing the issue in the post.....

BTW, it is claimed that this was a welfare issue (ie. relatives under threat from extremist Muslim nutters). That changes things slightly.

5:25 PM  
Anonymous HAGTBG said...

Anonymous (arguing against Israel),

Re: You lacking an agenda. You highjacked this post comments into something barely touching the post.

Re: your point on the 'Nationality and Entry into Israel Law' how is baring Palestinians (as opposed to Arabs) racist? Especially when its permitted as a temporary measure during hostilties.

Re: your quote from a rabbi unknown to me. Sentences lacking context from obscure people are worthless.

Re: "Jews actually managed to live and thrive in Arab lands until the land grab of '48." Surprisingly, you hear this a lot from Arab Moslems and very seldom from Sephardim from those lands. Anyway, its intersting that the Arabs blamed their local Jews for the 'Zionists' and then kicked them out to... Israel.

Re: your argument about Israeli IDs. You started about IDs but then it devolved into a point about the need to serve in the IDF. If your problem with the ID is so great why couldn't you keep your argument straight?

Re: Your comments about IDs and bathrooms. A wonderfully mature argument.

6:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Re: Your comments about IDs and bathrooms. A wonderfully mature argument.

Welcome to your apartheid.

Re: your argument about Israeli IDs. You started about IDs but then it devolved into a point about the need to serve in the IDF. If your problem with the ID is so great why couldn't you keep your argument straight?

Sorry about your problem with reading comprehension.

6:38 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Especially when its permitted as a temporary measure during hostilties.

Rather like the Jim Crow laws. A "temporary" measure to keep the "darkies" in their place.

/ A dozen people commit a crime
// Let's punish a million of them
/// Mmmmm, collective punishment.

6:40 PM  
Anonymous HAGTBG said...

Rather like war.

My grandmother was confined to 50 miles of the city she resided in in the US during WWII, because she was from Germany.

My uncle was sent to a UK concentration camp (in the classical sense of the term more similar to the US Japanese interment) for over a year. Again because of nationality

6:44 PM  
Anonymous HAGTBG said...

Anoynmous,

Please explain. My relatives were 'friendlies' but the state, in its interest confined them until they were sure of their loyalty.

But these Palestinians even if non-violent more than likely hate Israel.

Explain why Israel should not be allowed to keep them out in a time of hostilities.

6:54 PM  
Anonymous HAGTBG said...

One more thing, you continuously obfuscate the point. Jim Crow laws were aimed against a race. These laws are aimed against a nationality.

6:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I've been at this futile exercise all day hagtbg.

I have one final question for the anon-Israel-hater:

Is there anything anyone can say to you to convince you that Israel is NOT a racist state or the font of evil in the mideast and that Palestinians are not just passive victims in this very complex conflict?

If not, I think it's best if we all just leave this guy to his ignorant, self-serving opinions. Nothing more to say to someone who compares the horror of dragging Africans to the US in shackles and subjecting them to 200 years of slavery, humiliation and de facto racism with taking calculated precautions to prevent Israeli citizens from those sworn to wiping Israel off the map through the most heinous acts of violence.

Why are you on this blog, anyway? Clearly you've found places much more hospitable to bigots like yourself.

Oh and don't forget to ignore every valid point I've raised and probe your very limited vocabulary for the word "magnanamous" to sarcastically describe Israel in your response, cuz sarcasm is an effective way of minimizing Israel's attempt to find a reasonable balance in its treatment of Palestinians during a time of imminent danger to its citizens.

7:16 PM  
Blogger YMedad said...

Gee, it seems that it's so much fun to be "anonymous". Anyway, see what all this Israel bashing leads one: Prague

5:53 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Jews actually managed to live and thrive in Arab lands until the land grab of '48."

Oh yeah, everyone got along just fine, until those Zionist agitators came and ruined everything.

I am of course, being sarcastic. Someone who makes the above claim about the Jews having it swell in the pre-Israel Muslim world sounds just like one of those clueless Southern whites we used to see interviewed on TV during the Civil Rights era on the '60s, abosolutely perplexed about what had gotten into their good, loyal local "Negroes" (they would use another word beginning with "n" that shall not be repeated here). "Why," they would breathlessly say, "before this Dr. King fella and all of these outside agitators came down here and started stirring our local Negroes up with all of this talk about 'rights', everybody got along with each other just fine."

Sure they did -- because the "Negroes" knew their place, and knew very well what would happen to them if they dared to violate the local codes by say, trying to ride in the front of the bus, drink from the same water fountain or, G-d forbid, if a black boy or man were to even look at a white lady (the last was generally a hanging offense).

The same held true for Jews living in Muslim lands. They were accorded the status of "dhimmis" -- sort of second-class citizenship that meant the Muslims would deign to tolerate their presence IF they knew their place and did not get too "uppity" (to borrow a favorite white Southerner word), and if they acknowledged the superiority of Muslims, paid special opressive taxes, agreed to live in ghettos and abide by other humiliating laws that set them apart and marked them as inferior.

And if the local Muslim ruler happened to get it into his head that they were NOT showing that they "knew their place," and needed to be taught a lesson, there could be pogroms, even expulsions. The Rambam and his family were forced to flee Spain (then under Muslim rule) when a particularly hard-line sect called the Almohades -- sort of an 11th Century version of the Taliban -- took control. They went to Egypt, also Muslim, but a little more liberal.

So the so-called "golden age" of Muslim-Jewish relations, with the Jews knowing their place, firmly under the thumb of the Muslims (some clueless self-hating Jewish anti-Zionist leftists like the above poster, or treasonous phony "Orthodox" heretics Neturi Karta masochistically long to return to such a condition) may have been a little better than the horrile treatment they were getting at the same time in most of Christian Europe. But not much.

7:42 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ummmm. Israel is a Jewish State. By resolution of the United Nations. We don't apologise for it, and we're not going away. Deal with it.

11:02 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So the so-called "golden age" of Muslim-Jewish relations, with the Jews knowing their place, firmly under the thumb of the Muslims

You sound like you are a fan of fiction, or maybe it's a martyr complex.

Jews lived in Iraq 2,000 years --- it was so horrible they couldn't escape. Yeah, right.

I'm still waiting for someone to explain why Israeli IDs have "White", sorry, "Yehudi" written on them.

5:40 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My grandmother was confined to 50 miles of the city she resided in in the US during WWII, because she was from Germany.

Oh,your poor grandmother. What was that, 60 years ago. One would think that someone like you would be particularly sensitive about that.

/ Make sure you cover the "challah" tonight
// Wouldn't want to offend an inantimate object
/// People, OTOH, can die in a fire
//// You're such a nice person

5:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

But these Palestinians even if non-violent more than likely hate Israel.

More than likely?

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

*gasp*

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

5:44 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

These laws are aimed against a nationality.

How convenient. This form of discrimination is SO MUCH better. We are the CHOSEN people after all

/ Goyim can die in a fire for all I care

5:45 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

We don't apologise for it, and we're not going away. Deal with it.

Nice. Enjoy your apartheid and your idol worship

5:46 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh and don't forget to ignore every valid point I've raised and probe your very limited vocabulary for the word "magnanamous"

"magnanamous" -- huh? No such word.

/ Thank you. Drive through.

5:48 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Gee, it seems that it's so much fun to be "anonymous".

Gee, "ymedad" sounds like a pseudonym.

/That's SO MUCH better
// Don't you have any "fellow" citizens to oppress today?

5:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is there anything anyone can say to you to convince you that Israel is NOT a racist state

Start with this. If all citizens are "equal" -- why do some citizens have "Yehudi" on their ID documents? How is that important?

5:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My uncle was sent to a UK concentration camp (in the classical sense of the term more similar to the US Japanese interment) for over a year. Again because of nationality

Oh, your poor uncle. Thanks God it wasn't you.

Maybe you didn't get the memo, but discrimination, on that magnitude, is not in vogue in today's democracies

/ Thank you for not calling me an anti-Semite
// Drive through, please

5:54 PM  
Anonymous HAGTBG said...

You pithily disregard as irrelevant the suffering of people from 1939-1945 while expecting sympathy for others for events 3 years later.

One wonders whether you buy rotten applies in a fruit store lest you discriminate against them. You disregard the distinction meaningless distinctions (race) and ones with relevance (hostile nationality).

Frankly, I doubt your sincerity and good will. Trying to mischaracterize the claims against you as devolving into whether you are an anti-Semite (which you may be) is a standard canard.

10:27 AM  
Anonymous ObrotherWhereOrtho said...

WOW...just read through all of these posts in one sitting -
A very complex issue and both sides make some good points.

To me, it ALL comes down to this:
One side of this issue is concerned about the fact that there are people out there who, in the name of their cause, willingly and happily strap their children with nail laden explosives with the express intent of killing and maiming as many innocent woman and children as possible...while the other side is worried about "racism" and why ID cards have to say "yehudi" on them.

What we have here is the classic "Which came first...the chicken or the egg...". In other words, one side will say "if the Palestinians stop blowing themselves up in discos, pizza stores, on buses, at bus stops, at entry points, et...then maybe ID cards would no longer NEED to specify "Yehudi". On the other hand, Anon would reply that "...the REASON why young Palestinians resort to such tactics is because they are being "humiliated" and their proud heritage is being trampled upon. Perhaps if the "Illegal Zionist Entity" would stop the humiliation (And also please vacate the country - but that's a whole other discussion) then the "Palestinian people" would stop using such desperate measures.

Hmmm...Like I said, both sides make some good points ...

Bottom line - If you believe that Israel has the right to exist on any level than ALL (or at least most) of the actions that Israel has taken are logical, rational policies that insure the survival of the country.
IF...you do not believe that Israel has the right to exist...if you believe that Israel is a "Zionist Entity" illegally established on "Stolen land" - No matter how much logic or reason your arguments have, no matter how vicious and vile the Muslim extremist tactics are, no matter how many times you attempt to illustrate that Israel is merely acting in self defense...that while the Palestinians TARGET innocent women and children...while they attack defenseless "soft targets" like pedestrian filled buses...Israel is forced to respond by attempting to capture perpetrators who hide among their OWN people KNOWING full well that this will cause unintended casualties...all of your arguments are for naught...and fall on deaf ears. If you believe Israel has no right to exist than Israel's very existence is an anathema and ALL tactics to rid the world of the "Zionist Scourge" are acceptable" while all actions Israel takes - no matter how "justified" are unjustifiable.

11:18 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

/ you Hijacked this blog - much like you defend other hijackers
// you're a self-righteous know it all douche bag
/// Even though I don't like to resort to ad-homonym attacks - and even though I can out-debate you on every one of your points and leave you with your pants around your ankles - it's still fun to call you a self-righteous know-it-all douche bag
//// what do you have against Challah?
/////Drive through please??? You're not just a Self-righteous know-it-all douche bag ... you're a WEIRD self-righteous know-it -all douche bag.
Get a LIFE. If you’re so worried about world peace and all that jazz, stop defending cold blooded murderers like Hamas and go find a real cause to defend …

11:30 PM  
Anonymous Rivkale (who is not so cowardly as to be anon) said...

Confidential to Orthomom: why are you letting a troll take over the comments?

6:20 PM  
Blogger Shmilda said...

In case anyone still remembers OM's post -

My gut reaction would be to agree that "This is the beginning of the end for British policing," but on second thought I wonder if it wasn't just a prudent decision given the circumstances. If you were in the Israeli embassy, would you want your security to depend on someone acting on those views? He should be bounced from the Diplomatic Protection Group entirely, but in the interim I'm glad the Israeli embassy is not on his watch.

7:00 PM  

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