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Tuesday, March 13, 2007

Bizarro Experience Today

I am still sort of reeling from a bizarre incident that happened to me earlier today.

I was in kind of a low mood today for various inconsequential reasons, so I decided to duck out of work to do a little clothes shopping for Pesach - I envisioned a nice relaxing hour or so spent in retail therapy. Alas, it was not to be.

I walked into a store that had a cute dress in the window and was immediately accosted by a superthin, superblonde, superperky, superpushy sales person, offering to help. Now, I absolutely loathe pushy sales staff. When approached with the dreaded "Anything I can help you with today?", I have pretty much mastered the cool, disinterested response of "No thanks, just looking". It usually works as an instant deterrent to overly pushy sales people. Not today. Five seconds after I had selected some cute items and ensconced myself in the fitting room, a disembodied hand which I assume belonged to annoying pushy bleached blonde saleswoman (hereafter APBBS) appeared from behind the curtain, with some sort of flimsy green chiffon sequined miniskirt dangling from it. "Isn't this just adorable?" came the voice that I can only assume was attached to the hand, attached to APBBS. "I have it here in your size!" My reply: "Um, thanks, but it's just not me." Not thirty seconds later, APBBS: "How about this one?" This time, some sleeveless ruffled concoction appears, attached to the floating hand. How annoying? I figure that if I tell APBBS that the clothes have to be longer and have sleeves, perhaps APBBS will stop bothering me and I can try on my selections in peace. So I peek my head out and quickly explain to APBBS that the clothes have to be more modest, so thanks for all the suggestions, but no thanks. Her eyes widen in recognition as I see it click in her brain that I am "one of those", and she scurries away, hopefully to leave me alone for a few minutes.

Yeah. Nice try. Next up, waving from behind the velvet curtain? Some frothy little pink suit with black lace trim. Not exactly my taste (though I'll give the woman credit, it was relatively modest). "How about this, sweetie? It's great for synagogue!". Argh. "Thanks, it just isn't my style". And then again: "How about this darling sweater? All of the Jewish girls love it!" (She really really said that.) At that point, I was finishing up as fast as I could, and I came out to see how the dress looked in the mirror (this being a store with the annoying breed of fitting rooms that do not have a mirror in each individual room, forcing customers out to use the large communal mirror - all the better to give the pushy annoying sales staff every opportunity to get access to torture you). At which point, APBBS came over and began tying the sash for me and adjusting the dress. The dress which I was actually wearing at that moment. At which point, due to my feelings about getting touched by people I don't know but already don't like, I sort of started backing away from her. At which point, APBBS said "Don't worry, you can let me touch you to fix your belt, I'm Jewish too, so I'm a very clean woman". At which point, Orthomom was rendered completely speechless for a moment. When I found my tongue, I mumbled something about not liking strangers to touch me, whether they were Jewish or non-Jewish (not necessarily the appropriate response to her bizarro comment, but really, is there actually even an appropriate response to such a bizarro comment??), got dressed and got the heck out of the store.

But the whole experience was a bit unnerving for me. I could have taken the idiotic comments about an outfit being "great for synagogue" or "what all the Jewish girls are wearing". That may well just be APBBS's idea of what pandering to a potential customer means. (I think you should try this skirt on, it's perfect for eating Matzah! Wouldn't this shirt would be great for lighting Hanukah candles!) But her comment that implied that I somehow was annoyed that she was touching me because she was a non-Jew? Do you think there are really people who live and work in the middle of Manhattan who think that an Orthodox Jew wouldn't be allowed to casually touch a non-Jew because they are somehow unclean? You have to wonder how many layers of misinformation and misunderstandings about Orthodox Judaism would bring someone (who claims to be Jewish, to boot!) to think that.

65 Comments:

Blogger DAG said...

I can see how the no male-female touching could be misconstrued

11:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wow, that is, as you say, "bizzarro". Though this woman sounds like she was probably well-meaning.

11:04 PM  
Blogger orthomom said...

DAG said...

I can see how the no male-female touching could be misconstrued


I agree, but think how many layers of misconstruing there would have to have been. The male/female misunderstanding, in addition to the weird jew/non-jew misconception.

11:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

great story, classic ny.

11:33 PM  
Blogger Barbara said...

some sort of odd planetary alignment as well as an offloading of the Mothership.

I HATE pushy salespeople. I almost want to say to them "no you can't help me, I know what I am looking for and if you don't leave me alone - you will lose a sale."

But I don't. I am too damn polite. Even when I was very pregnant with my twins - and people wanted to touch my belly. (I really dislike being touched at all now) It took a while for me to tell them to back off.

Really a twilight zone moment for you Orthomom!

11:33 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think it all comes down to people mistaking the insular nature of our community with a superiority complex

from the APBBS to the school board

11:45 PM  
Blogger Ezzie said...

Perhaps someone gave a really poor explanation of (or she horribly misunderstood) niddah?

11:51 PM  
Anonymous goyguy said...

"Do you think there are really people who live and work in the middle of Manhattan who think that an Orthodox Jew wouldn't be allowed to casually touch a non-Jew because they are somehow unclean? You have to wonder how many layers of misinformation and misunderstandings about Orthodox Judaism would bring someone (who claims to be Jewish, to boot!) to think that."

Trust me, the layers are endless.

I had Orthodox neighbors as a kid in the 60s who my parents were (and for that matter, still are) very good friends with. My folks made sure as kids we understood and respected their lifestyles, religious beliefs and holidays. To the point of "Don't cut the damn lawn on Saturday morning you dopey kid, the neighbors are observing the Sabbath" Not that they would have cared. It was just the neighborly thing to do.

I've also been fortunate enough to have spent well over a decade in business working in the Orthodox community.

When I hear some of the things that 'my people' think goes on in the "Orthodox world" it's really amazing. Where do people get this stuff?

But to be fair, some Orthodox folks are equally oblivious to what goes on in the rest of the world. The questions people ask me are pretty funny sometimes, but the very fact that people are willing to learn and to explain their own traditions to others shows that they simply misunderstood, not that they were being mean.

So, OM, did you feel like you were in an episode of Sienfeld, or what? ;-) "All the Jewish girls love it"...thats great.

12:56 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/?p=5603#comments

touching poem

1:59 AM  
Blogger tnspr569 said...

Ugh. ::shudders::

Freaky.

At least you escaped when you did.

My sympathies.

7:14 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great story. But it doesn't surprise me one bit. I have met up with similar attitudes from coworkers. "Did the rabbi bless that sandwich?"

7:55 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm thinking back 20 years ago when I was in your shoes, Orthomom - working in the city, shopping in the city...I dont' think the typical salesperson would have even had the opportunity to be exposed to many religious Jewish women and their clothing requirements. Most religious women shopped at local stores in their own neighborhoods with the exception of major department stores. So in a way this is a good thing. Our numbers have grown and we are more out there, hopefully setting good examples for the world to learn.

8:08 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Maybe APBBS is gay or bi and thought you were hot. Maybe that's why she wanted to touch you.

8:28 AM  
Blogger YMedad said...

That's just the reason why I don't buy anything in those stores.

Naw, just kidding.

8:55 AM  
Blogger I'm Haaretz, Ph.D. said...

lol!

When I started working, I was forced to explain to a certain coworker, who was very touchy feely and needed some ground rules, about the basics of shomer negiah and that he should not be offended but I won't be hugging him every time we come back from the weekend, etc.

He automatically assumed that it was because he wasn't Jewish (as in, the reason we don't intermarry is because we don't touch gentiles)! He could not believe that I don't touch Jewish guys either... it was very uncomfortable! I probably should have hugged him just to avoid the conversation :)

9:21 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I recall hearing a local 5T Rabbi say how lucky he was that he rarely has to look at goyim while he admires the difficult we have, in having to see/look at goyim on a weekly basis. so I would not be suprised if some Yiddim do not want ta'ma people touching them.

9:41 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think that you were in a REALLY bad mood and nothing was going to fix it. Your store story... tell me where. I don't even know a place anymore that offers help. You should have had a piece of chocolate instead. Better luck today.

9:45 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Your store story... tell me where. I don't even know a place anymore that offers help.

Of course they do. This must be one of those Manahttan boutiques. Those pushy sales staff can kill a person with kindness.

9:55 AM  
Anonymous alan said...

I was astonished by the ignorance in the comment thread to the Gothamist article about Shabbos keys in Stuy-town. I think in the last 30 years general ignorance about Orthodox Jews has skyrocketed among the rest of the population - probably because we never interact with the rest of the population anymore, especially as kids.

9:59 AM  
Anonymous alan said...

I'll specify "interact SOCIALLY", so mutual respect and understanding can be engendered.

10:00 AM  
Anonymous Fox said...

I'm usually in the camp advancing the benign intentions argument, but I believe these encounters are indicators of the demographic shift occurring among American Jews.

Let's face it: it's easier for many nonobservant Jews to set up straw men concerning Yiddishkeit rather than be honest with themselves and say, "I don't want to make the sacrifice of keeping kosher," etc.

Many of the people we meet today were fed erroneous information about Orthodox life by their parents and grandparents, who wanted an excuse to abandon Jewish life. And, to be fair, being observant was a lot tougher 75 years ago! Some of us might not have withstood the challenge ourselves.

Some simply feel threatened by increased Orthodox visibility, and are a bit too eager to pass along negative interpretations.

I come into contact with reprentatives of non-frum institutions through my work, and not a week goes by that I don't hear a gem from a kind, well-meaning, and otherwise educated Jew.

This week is still young, but last week's winner was the woman who explained that no one in her congregation can observe kashrus because "we don't live in NYC, so we can't get any kosher food -- we'd starve to death".

10:42 AM  
Blogger frumhouse said...

"Don't worry, you can let me touch you to fix your belt, I'm Jewish too, so I'm a very clean woman"

I actually laughed when I read that line. You should have asked her if she dipped in the mikvah before work to be able to touch the Jewish ladies.

That is just awful! I also hate unwanted touching from strangers. It hasn't happened to me for awhile - but when I was pregnant? Oh boy! People think that pregnant women are open territory. It's ok to touch, rub, jiggle, bump, shake and roll that belly! Hands off, I say!

This woman had no right to touch you, nor put her "floating hands" into your dressing room. You didn't ask for her help.

Ironically, she lost a sale with her pushy tactics.

10:58 AM  
Blogger Miriam said...

I was reading a book on the Jews in Shanghai during WWII (to help my daughter with a report... she was too young to actually read this particular book herself, and only needed a small bit of info from it) and I came across this particular gem, when the main character was trying to convince (successfully) a non-religious friend to not get engaged to one of those "crazy" Mir Yeshiva Bochurim: "You'll have to go to the mikvah after every menstruation ends to be dunked and blessed over by the Rabbis." Okay, who here has ever seen Rabbis present at a woman's monthly mikvah visit, (conversion to Judaism ceremonies excepted, of course)?

Anyway, I would have been just as creeped out, by the pushiness, by the touching especially, and by the strange comments. Sorry you had to go through that!

11:09 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i agree there should be no touching except i try not to touch you disgusting filthy people

apbbs

12:42 PM  
Anonymous Azamat said...

GoyGuy...great comment!
I always enjoy your comments - they are very refreshing and give me hope. You seem to really "get us" (orthos). You get that, yes, we have some strange customs and tend to be private/shy to outsiders but that we are inherently good people who are just a bit misunderstood.
I may be wrong, but that's what I've gleaned from your comments in the past.
Anyway, regarding your comment above - Can you give us some juicy examples of some of the more common and /or comical misconceptions people have about orthodox Jews?
I think we'd all like to hear this from you perspective.
The classic that comes to mind is the old "Hole in the sheet" myth...

2:42 PM  
Blogger Abbi said...

Fox-
You should read this week's Jewish week.

This woman writes in about the recent conservative kashrut teshuva explaining that it's too hard for Jews in the boondocks to keep kosher, because they need to go to restaurants for quality time with their spouses and because "It's too hard to cook 21 meals a week for your family" (!)

It's really unbelievable the crazy ideas people assume are a general truth for everyone.

5:24 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

give me a break. It is hard to cook 21 meals a week !

5:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"
I agree, but think how many layers of misconstruing there would have to have been. The male/female misunderstanding, in addition to the weird jew/non-jew misconception."

Not that many layers! Chazal gave a shiksa a din as if she were a niddah specifically so we (you know, the default male we) wouldn't touch them.

6:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ortho- if you werent so passive aggressive, this wouldnt have been a problem.

7:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The vision of Orhtomom ensconced in the fitting room.

The vision of OrthoMom in a little suit with black lace trim.

The vision of Orthomom touched around the waste by a superthin, superblonde woman.

The vision of Orthomom in a flimsy green chiffon sequined miniskirt.

The vision of Orhtomom on the receiving end of floating hand.

The vision of Orthomom tied with a sash wearing an adjustable the dress.

I think I'm about to have a Bizzaro experience myself.

Later, babe.

10:53 PM  
Blogger Steg (dos iz nit der ┼íteg) said...

i would boycott the store for being that pushy. not to mention offensive. there's a beggar in my neighborhood who makes believe he's jewish because he thinks it'll make the jews more likely to give him money.

11:23 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"superthin, superblonde, superperky"

Get over yourself.

12:55 AM  
Anonymous your musar neighbour said...

you shouldnt have played hookey from work and gone shopping but rather go aehad to teshuva

1:49 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's how it happens.

Right in beautiful downtown Cedarhurst there's a little shop that sells imported children's clothes. The shopkeeper, Jewish/Israeli, had been warned numerous times by the broker for an imported line of clothing against smuggling in the clothing line and avoiding the import fee set by the licensed broker.

The broker went into the store Tuesday afternoon and told the shopkeeper, after seeing contraband clothing in the store, that she was going to call the authorities. The broker left the store to make a call on her cell and the shopkeeper came outside and threw a hot cup of coffee on the broker. the broker called the Police and the shopkeeper was taken away in cuffs. The broker was overheard saying, "This is the last time I do business with Jews."

4:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 10:53 PM- Absolutely hysteical!!!

Anon 4:01 PM - Is this a true story?!?

Goy Guy- You are a Good Guy

4:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It certainly is.

5:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i am not one of those touchy feely people with anyone, and it boggles my mind how people (men and women, jewish and not) think nothing of violating someone else's three feet of personal space.

When I see someone leaning in for that hug - I always say "i don't do that" with my hand up. and then i smile to lessen the tension and change the subject. after 11 years in the outside world i've really mastered this.

11:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And the best thing is you never need ice in your beverages.

11:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

huh?

12:03 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

orthomom can you tell us the name of the store so i can tell my RA BBI get up on shabbos on the bima and tell us all to boycott the store (just like they did in Gourmet Glatt)!

12:40 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

orthomom can you tell us the name of the store so i can tell my RA BBI get up on shabbos on the bima and tell us all to boycott the store (just like they did in Gourmet Glatt)!

I love it!! lets just force that dress shop owner to sell her business. that will teach her a lesson!

8:39 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

my wife had an opposite experience in Boora Park.
Being M.O., the salewomen didnt even approach her. She was able to shop in peace without ebing harrassed. Its like when we are in Brooklyn for a Shabbos and go to my family's yeshivish shul. The women do not even ackknowledge her with a Good Shabbos.

10:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm sure you get mail looking for donations from all those Boro Park shuls & yeshivas

4:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i actually live in brooklyn and keep on getting shnoor letters from the five towns and farrockaway mosdos

HUH????????????

10:42 PM  
Blogger Married and Navigating Jewish Brooklyn said...

Sounds like a 'fun' place to shop.

Though we loath Jewish Stores typically because they dont have helpful staff...but that store really had a too helpful staff

1:27 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great post. An OM classic!

2:29 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

the caf hachaim paskins u must wash your hands after u shake hands with a gentile

1:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Midvar sheker t'rchak

4:46 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

RDC: Aren't you giving shiur at 1:34pm?

4:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

bizzaro- isnt he a doctor in the 5T

2:30 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great story. I hope you can laugh at it now.

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